Just been watching some of Mike Busch’s videos and this great one on doing prebuys
has a comment of his under the video:
I thought this was highly relevant to so many similar discussions we have had here, on the likelihood of internal engine corrosion.
It’s a brilliant video anyway. Super comments especially around 22:00 on using somebody independent.
Peter wrote:
You don’t need to pay 3k to somebody to keep track of what needs doing
Their might be the need to setup a maintenance program and a cardex, this might be included as well, and can be quite time consuming. Therefore it is needed to know what kind of work is done by the CAMO for that amount.
provided it conforms to certain minimum standards (MIP, Minimum Inspection Program), and provided it covers all ‘Airworthiness Limitations’ in the mnf Maintenance Manual and in any Mandatory SB’s.
I don’t think compliance with "mandatory "SBs (as per the manufacturer) is needed in a self-declared maintenance program.
1.5% for hull insurance is too high.
I agree with Peter that you should be careful to rent out your plane to a school. Whether they shag it or not, the resale value of the aircraft suffers extra when a future buyer hears that it’s been used for training. Plus your aircraft will be down for maintenance regularly, scheduled and non-scheduled, which may interfere with your own use.
3000 indeed seems a lot for the CAMO service, but do find out what they do for that money. Usually what a CAMO does is to keep track of what maintenance needs to be done at which point in time, according to the approved maintenance program and any Mandatory Service Bulletins that pop up. They also take care of any updates to the maintenance manuals as directed by the manufacturer, Diamond. And take care of Airworthiness Review Certificates. I guess that 1500 should do for that kind of work.
As you may be aware, new maintenance rules are being introduced, and for ELA-2 aircraft (DA42) they are expected to be in place by the end of this year. AFAIUI no need to have a CAMO for Non-Commercial Ops (flight training is NCO). And you can write your own maintenance program, provided it conforms to certain minimum standards (MIP, Minimum Inspection Program), and provided it covers all ‘Airworthiness Limitations’ in the mnf Maintenance Manual and in any Mandatory SB’s. As an example, the engine TBR is not an Airworthiness Limitation, just a ‘strong recommendation’ by the manufacturer to throw them away after x hours. Especially in a twin you may want to disregard that recommendation and keep flying them :) In conclusion: investing some time in getting yourself up to speed with (various of the) above tasks and the ins and outs of what kind of maintenance really needs to be done is going to save you money, both in terms of CAMO expenses and in the actual maintenance tasks.
Insurance: Rough numbers: 1500 for third party insurance, hull insurance: 1.5% of agreed value. So total would be 6000 for a 300k aircraft. But usually that goes up if the aircraft is used for training.
600€/month for insurance is high because they want a “Club” use with many pilots insure.
We pay 4000 per year for our 2007 DA42…
Romain
I would get alternative insurance quotes… I was paying £6k 10 years ago for “club use” which was any number of un-named pilots, with just PPLs. Hull value agreed at 195k.
Be very careful with renting your plane to a school. This is a really big topic. Been there, done that, nearly got burnt. It can work but basically the plane will get shagged. Also schools are generally very clever in getting novice aircraft owners to rent them planes under very favourable terms. It can work if the planes will be used only for dual training i.e. an instructor always present, but then the school will later say they are not getting the expected utilisation because self fly hire is not allowed.
I forgot to inform that the CAMO is owned by the flight school and if the da42 I buy is under their camo they will consider rent my airplane.
Also they offered me insurance price for 600 euros a month.
Your comments are really appreciated. Just don’t want to get screwed.
Peter wrote:
IME few companies do light GA insurance outside their own country. Almost none of the UK based ones do. I once asked every insurer at Aero EDNY and none of them would touch a UK based plane.
Well… All my club aircraft are insured in Denmark.
Hmmm, this is a plane, not the space shuttle.
Maintenance (working out what needs doing; a CAMO doesn’t actually “do” any actual work) is not a difficult thing.
You don’t need to pay 3k to somebody to keep track of what needs doing – unless the EASA66 guys in the hangar are totally stupid and useless and want to take the plane to bits, throw half the bits away and replace them, and put it all back together, and then yes paying somebody 3k to stop them throwing half the bits away (and only throw say 10% of the bits away) will save you money 
If a 3k CAMO can pay for itself, someone should be able to post a real life case study.
