boscomantico wrote:
The exemption is only for route charges. These are ATC fees for using the airport and apply when flying to two handfuls of bigger airports in Germany, VFR or IFR. That has been the case for decades.
VFR? I haven’t received an invoice yet.
C210_Flyer wrote:
While there are plenty of places that dont charge you. Dont you feel a bit obligated to leave them something?
Not generally, because most often I park my plane in public areas, not on FBO leaseholds. I buy fuel from pumps that are likewise publicly accessible, typically self serve. I don’t often know who I’m buying from – I just pull up the pump, buy my fuel and leave.
Not everyone uses their plane to impress their girl friends.
(The girlfriends I used to pick were not that easily impressed, it took more than an airplane).
You want to put the discussion on this low level?
The rest: too complicated thinking for me. I think you have a very exclusive idea how things have to be and what you will pay for and what drives you crazy. I for one will simply tolerate the € 5 at EDMS. All in all it’s a good deal for me.
Where do you land Walmart parking lots? While there are plenty of places that dont charge you. Dont you feel a bit obligated to leave them something? I usually buy fuel for the plane and if they give me a courtesy car I usually top that off before I bring it back. Or I leave money in the coffee kitty. Because I know if they close, Il be landing at the nearest Mall because there will be no airport to land at.
Regarding where I fly just because you dont see any reason to fly there doesnt mean I should agree with you. Can we agree on that?
I flew into those airports because it was convenient. And I wanted to make a point that those airports in the US are accessible without having to rob a bank to be able to leave.
Accessibility is equated to utility. That is what we have in the US and is missing in Europe.
My daughter studied at Albany U for four years and I would fly to KALB to visit her for a day trip. The FBO was Million Air They would lend me a courtesy car for the day and if not then I would either get a cab or rent a car. The University was 20 mins away by car. I would buy fuel from them and it would cost me $20 for the use of the facilities. Unbelievable cheap at double the price. They have a great ILS and Deicing and hangar when needed. The FBO is still in Business 25 yrs later so they must be doing something right. Who in their right mind would fly to another airport farther away and spend 1.5 hrs driving back to Albany?
Regarding those other cities I would attend conferences and lectures as well as personal visits. As an example, If you want to go to Boston why wouldnt you want to fly into Logan and take the subway into the city? You would be in the heart of Boston in 20 mins.? Before the Americans went crazy and you wanted to go to Wash DC, why wouldnt you fly in to Reagan airport and be right in the heart of the city? Now its either Alexandrea or Dulles neither as convenient.
Do you understand the value of utility and flying? Not everyone uses their plane to impress their girl friends.
C210_Flyer wrote:
Ive landed at Dulles, Reagan, Logan, Charlotte, Nashville etc etc and never paid more than $25 for landing 0 for handling with fuel purchase. Oh by the way no additional fee with an IFR Approach. So that post where the guy spent $75 for the FBO (as was mentioned) was because he didnt buy fuel. Sometimes there is a minimum of 25 or 50 gal. With my 210 that was never a problem.
I see no reason to do any of the above. What’s being missed here is that at most airports used by GA in the USA there is either (1) a public airplane parking lot that costs ~$5/night deposited into a little envelope when you leave (for example this is the case at my 600 operations per day base) or (2) a little FBO who will either charge you nothing for parking or a trivial amount or (3) a place to stick your plane out of the way where nobody will know or care, possibly because the entire airport is unattended and there is no mechanism to pay anybody. Almost no pilot with a single pays more, because its rarely necessary. Why would you go to some CAT airport or pay some fancy biz jet FBO to use his facility when it is completely avoidable without introducing any inconvenience? To impress your girl friend?
Again, I have never paid to land anywhere, any time in my entire flying history (even in Europe as it happens) except for one airport on a privately owned island. I have never paid for short term parking and the most I have paid for overnight parking is the aforementioned $5/day. If I park my airplane for just a couple of hours I typically don’t even know who controls the spot in which I park, nobody is paying enough attention and nobody notices that I’ve come or gone.
And you really talk about Germany? I for one would categorize it as blackmailing if i have to buy fuel to avoid high fees.
Why do i have to pay a fee when i don‘t want any of the FBOs services? It‘s interesting that you don‘t seem to have a problem with that.
Earlier I asked the question of Achim , how many flights were filed on an IFR flight plan last year into EDMS? Just curious as to the answer.
You guys especially Alexis are so hung up on the 5Euros an expression comes to mind They look but dont see, they listen but dont hear.
Are you baiting me with this 5 Euro crap? Thats all you guys seem to care about is the MONEY.
Yet I consistently tell you its bigger than that. Its a whole new pricing structure that they are instituting. Similar to when the Govt comes up with a new type of tax and sells it by saying, “it wont effect you, only the rich.” “Yeah go after those rich scoundrels they can afford it,” the mob cries. Then before too long the tax is imposed on them as well. Good work geniuses. Let the govt apply a new tax then see how long it takes for them to get rid of it. Answer: Never
I bring up the US GA only because Ive read on this forum people referring to it as Nirvana. Well its only that way because people fight for it.
Regarding FBOs in the US its rare that they charge, if you buy some fuel from them. Most of the time we ride on the coat tails of the Jet A crowd. But Ive never in 30 yrs of flying have I ever felt awkward in the executive lounge. Every FBO has made me feel welcome. Courtesy cars ,free coffee donuts, etc etc and most of all a nice smile.
Ive landed at Dulles, Reagan, Logan, Charlotte, Nashville etc etc and never paid more than $25 for landing 0 for handling with fuel purchase. Oh by the way no additional fee with an IFR Approach. So that post where the guy spent $75 for the FBO (as was mentioned) was because he didnt buy fuel. Sometimes there is a minimum of 25 or 50 gal. With my 210 that was never a problem. 
Straubing in my SR22 is € 25 and if i was IFR another € 5.
Alexis wrote:
A little OT, but interesting: I just followed a discussion of some pilots on COPA about mandatory FBO charges at some (many?) US airfields. One guy went to Jackson Hole, WY, to pick up a passenger and had to pay $ 75 to the FBO + $ 17.50 for the landing. He only stayed there for ten minutes.
He landed at a major destination resort for $92.50. If there for 10 mins he didn’t buy fuel. You couldn’t land at Straubing for that particularly if IFR….:)
