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Advice to buy aerobatic aircraft for A-UPRT training?

Hi,

Our ATO is considering to get an aerobatic airplane for A-UPRT course we are going to offer. I would like to get some advice from users which aerobatic plane is best suited for A-UPRT training?

I have been looking at the following airplanes:
- Citarbia,
- T67 Firefly
- Robin 2160 aerobatic
- Scottish Aviation bulldog
- Pitts S2S

Also which one is inexpensive to operate according to EASA??

thanks

ESGT/ESGP, Sweden

@ABCD while I understand A-UPRT may allow tandem seating, the spirit of the course is for side by side.

From the list you presented, if you can find one, I would go for the Bulldog, Robin and Firefly in that order.

The Lycoming Zlin 242 is probably the best UPRT aircraft I have used. Incredibly honest and can carry out all aerobatic manoeuvres, albeit not designed as a competition aircraft.

You could also use a Grob 115.

The Firefly is the most common but has somewhat unpredictable incipient spin tendencies, and the potential for unintentional high rotation spin.

I was happiest with an SOP that mandated parachutes and had a clear abandon aircraft height.

Oxford (EGTK)

the problem is these aircraft you mentioned (Bulldog, Robin and Firefly) are not that easy to find for purchase.
I have also looked at Cessna 150/152 aerobatic and they are easier to find in Europe.

ESGT/ESGP, Sweden

Why not a Saab Safir? If you can find one for sale which is not experimental.

Remember that you need to check the available payload in utility category. Some of these might not be suitable at all if you wish to stay within mass and balance…

Sweden, Sweden

Other than the poor visibility and relatively modest power, the Aerobat is perfectly serviceable. Having to climb regularly to safety altitude behind a -235 might make the three hour syllabus more like five :)

Oxford (EGTK)

Or why not rent the Robin at the closest aeroclub?

Sweden, Sweden

Fly310 wrote:

Or why not rent the Robin at the closest aeroclub?

Another flight school (ATO) is renting this aircraft already.

Fly310 wrote:

Why not a Saab Safir? If you can find one for sale which is not experimental.

If you know anyone for sale let me know

Last Edited by ABCD at 26 Jul 21:36
ESGT/ESGP, Sweden

https://www.planecheck.com/?ent=da&id=51053
planecheck_G_KDOG_51053_pdf

You would need to check aerobatic TT remaining, but based on the quoted Fatigue Index and the typical mild A-UPRT sortie, DH support might advise you will get a decent remaining life.

Compared to the old course, the new course hardly explores nose high, or nose low and does not require spin training.

Last Edited by RobertL18C at 26 Jul 21:50
Oxford (EGTK)

@RobertL18C the aircraft you mentioned is sold.

ESGT/ESGP, Sweden

@ABCD while the Bulldog would be a good candidate, having it looked after away from the UK might have been a challenge.

UPRT capable aircraft are now hard to find. A fine HKAF T67-200 was sold two years ago for around EUR40k, a Zlin 242 sold a year ago for EUR35k – both these aircraft today probably worth 100% more.

This seems a good Zlin 142, as I mentioned earlier, the Zlin is a very good principles of flight laboratory demonstrator, and in my view the best UPRT trainer devised. My experience is with the 242, so not sure what differences exist with the 142, although the type is the same family.

https://www.planecheck.com?ent=da&id=51356
planecheck_D_EWKT_51356_pdf

Oxford (EGTK)
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