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Why the obsession with TBM's and PC12's, when a Mustang is much cheaper?

JasonC wrote:

It was $109.70/hr for Proparts (airframe parts) and $112.26/hr for each engine.

Thanks. That’s a pretty frugal $33K per year for a 100hr average pilot use. And the Proparts program you could forego if you wanted to as well, which means this jet could be flown for $22K in fixed costs/year. I don’t think a TBM would be a cent cheaper. Obviously, TBM burns less, but also cost twice as much to buy.

quatrelle wrote:

Is this what you mean ?

https://www.controller.com/listings/aircraft/for-sale/23330433/2009-cessna-citation-mustang

I would assume that needs two engines overhauled. A lot of cycles given its airtaxi use.

EGTK Oxford

would assume that needs two engines overhauled. A lot of cycles given its airtaxi use.

The question would be if the P&W engines in contrast to the Williams can be run on condition with just a hot section.AdamFrisch wrote:

Thanks. That’s a pretty frugal $33K per year for a 100hr average pilot use.

I fear that will not work. I sum it up about 100 EUR/hour parts, maybe 100 EUR/hour labour, 200 EUR/hour engines, 150 hours per year minimum billed, so a total of about 60kEUR per year. Then hangar plus cheap European insurance plus maybe annual simulator training you are looing at maybe 85k EUR on the programms per year before the thing did move an inch.

Is this what you mean ?

Actually I saw this one:
http://www.planecheck.com?ent=da&id=43851
It has more time on the engine than a private owner will ever need but probably the hot section will come up and break the bank ;-)

Every time I look into those things for the fun of it I realize how cheap a PA46 is to tun. Probably we are all wrong in this discussion and the real bargain in a few years will be a pre owned Piper M600.

www.ing-golze.de
EDAZ

So the Mustang Nxi upgrade has just been announced.

https://www.ainonline.com/aviation-news/business-aviation/2019-02-07/g1000nxi-now-available-citation-mustang

This will be very popular I think as the G1000 platform struggles.

EGTK Oxford

I realise it’s a complete thread drift, but I’m very weary of planes where the avionics being kept up to date depends on the proactiveness of the original plane manufacturer – some of them are stupid enough to only care about new aircraft sales, and do not support second hand owners at all. The typical bad example is Piper with the G1000 PA46, it took a lot of pressure from owners before they started offering an upgrade path for the ADS-B mandate. Because of the integration between airframe and avionics, even if a solution (software or hardware) exists, you’re stuck until the airframe manufacturer invests in getting approval. This is particularly probematic when the number of planes in the fleet is not large.

With modular avionics, you can do whatever you want.

And avionics stay current for 10-15 years if you’re lucky, a lot less than airframes.

Last Edited by denopa at 10 Feb 21:44
EGTF, LFTF

denopa wrote:

I realise it’s a complete thread drift, but I’m very weary of planes where the avionics being kept up to date depends on the proactiveness of the original plane manufacturer – some of them are stupid enough to only care about new aircraft sales, and do not support second hand owners at all. The typical bad example is Piper with the G1000 PA46, it took a lot of pressure from owners before they started offering an upgrade path for the ADS-B mandate. Because of the integration between airframe and avionics, even if a solution (software or hardware) exists, you’re stuck until the airframe manufacturer invests in getting approval. This is particularly probematic when the number of planes in the fleet is not large.

I agree with this. Piper and Cessna have both been poor with this in my view. The upgrade I recently made has the STC held by the avionics manufacturer not the OEM.

EGTK Oxford

I would probably never buy a plane on which I could not access the config pages of the avionics. AFAIK that rules out even the G500… unless you have a friendly dealer who can lend you the access codes.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

You can easily access config pages of the G1000.
For mine (C182), I had to buy updates via Cessna but I installed it by myself (previously I installed Chartview also by myself).
I also changed the transponder code of a PA46 G1000 : no difficulties
You can find on internet the maintenance guide quite easily

Sure, and I have a pile of G500 and G1000 IMs in my private collection, but I am told by a couple of installers that one needs special dealer-only codes to do some of the module config. I don’t know any details.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom
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