I flew in to a UK airfield on Saturday…calling up five minutes or so out. An air/ground Radio service. We passed the standard messages and then there was silence on the radio – no other traffic. As I approached the overhead I called again and then a few seconds later suddenly a Robin with angled wings flew massively fast towards me from my one o’clock. (He then passed on my right – close, but not massively close, but at the same height) The closing speed was incredible. (I was flying at about 130 knots, and I guess the other plane was too.) I have the recordings and he had not spoken to the ground station and was happily flying through their ATZ without speaking to them..or announcing his presence to me or others in the circuit. (In fact it was just me in the circuit.) The other plane, having heard me call up on a standard overhead join announced as being from the south, would have known that if he continued on his route north to south through the ATZ he’d be approaching me head-on.
I called “traffic!” on the radio for no reason I can think of – just panic I think. The look on my face in the video and the subsequent swearing says it all. The other plane replied “We saw you coming” without ending the message with his call sign. (All caught on my video) But I don’t believe him for one second because seeing him approach and pass me on the video at say 250kts, it’s clear to me that he was not visible to me until about 2 seconds away and the same must be true of my plane to him – invisible. (5 seconds away at 250 kts is 700 yards away by my calculation. It’s not very easy to recognise a stationary plane head on at 700 yards on the ground. Something 700 yards away moving really quickly towards you, against a white cloud background, is almost completely invisible)
I phoned the airfield today. The CFI told me that their fleet doesn’t include any angled wings Robins (just some of the older Robins with straight metal wings). He was completely unimpressed by the other chap’s airmanship flying through their ATZ unannounced.
So, what happens if I report this to the Airprox Board? They’ll investigate. Speak to the other pilot if they can trace him (probably can) but then they do nothing. So what is the point? Anyone have a view?
Perhaps I should just make a few bob on YouTube by posting the video and waiting for the first thousand views…
(BTW, sadly my PowerFlarm can be seen issuing an alarm in the video, but only about half a second before the closest approach. The approach speed is simply too fast for the machine to recognise the threat until too late. This because the other plane had no ADS-B Out, or Flarm, just a transponder that doesn’t of course give a direction signal to the PowerFlarm collision avoidance device.)
If this occurred in an ATZ the airfield manager should initiate a MOR (Mandatory Occurence Reporting) if you report an airprox. Some inconvenience but hopefully leads to lessons learned. If the Robin was in the overhead, may it have been above the ATZ?
Howard wrote:
So, what happens if I report this to the Airprox Board? They’ll investigate. Speak to the other pilot if they can trace him (probably can) but then they do nothing. So what is the point? Anyone have a view?
Because of this quote
Howard wrote:
The other plane replied “We saw you coming” without ending the message with his call sign.
I would probably report it yes. People like this are dangerous and need to be spoken to. PARTICULARLY if it’s true that he saw you coming and took no avoiding action.
Howard wrote:
Perhaps I should just make a few bob on YouTube by posting the video and waiting for the first thousand views…
That would probably be beneficial as well, as long as you post it on places where GA pilots watch too. Alone reading your message rises the hair on by back, a video would be very good to drive the message home, there can be traffic anytime, anywhere.
Yes my question was the same as Robert. Are you sure he was in the ATZ? Maybe he did take avoiding action.
For the record, the other plane was clearly in the ATZ by height and lateral position. (The GPS in my plane clearly shows my position and he was very close.)
Why not post a link to the video?
Having just been through the process I can say the Board will make every effort to trace the aircraft. The point of the process is for both parties to “learn any lessons” that might follow, as is the case for the wider audience. Sadly, one or other or both parties might not tell the truth, but that would be a great shame. However, regardless of whether or not they do, the process is a very good way of concentrating minds, considering what has occurred and seeing the event from the other pilot’s point of view, so in circumstances where you feel there was a risk it is a worth while process, and you have as much a responsibility to yourself as the other pilot to do so.
I would only temper my comments by adding that pilots should always try and talk to each other after such an event (if that proves possible) and recognise in some cases, perhaps through inexperience what might seem a close encounter to you in fact wasnt, there was not a risk, and the other pilot was aware of the situation.
This incident does not seem to fall within the above, so yes, very categorically you should file a report.
I have filed such a report before….classified as a B risk. I doubt the other pilot (flying below the London TMA, without a transponder and in loose formation) learned anything except “don’t get caught”. I’m a bit skeptical of the value of another report.
The video is still on my computer. I’ll load it up on YouTube in the next few days.
If filing an airprox, online, put a link to your YouTube video. I did that in 2015. Technically my fault, as I told them. Paraglider had right of way. Airprox guys were very pleasant.
Remember the OTHER guy may file, with his version. Video is very usefull
Howard wrote:
I have filed such a report before….classified as a B risk. I doubt the other pilot (flying below the London TMA, without a transponder and in loose formation) learned anything except “don’t get caught”. I’m a bit skeptical of the value of another report.
Isn’t the point for both pilots to hopefully learn something?
