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Doing a standalone FAA PPL in Europe

Has anybody done this in recent years, using their previous (European based) flight training in total as a credit towards the FAA PPL i.e. without having to re-do all of the 40hrs required under Part 61 for the FAA PPL?

If anyone has, can you describe the exact procedure used?

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

I have considered doing a standalone FAA PPL/IR and not the piggy-bag route and would have to do only the 2 theory exams for PPL and IR at Le Bourget and an exam. Somehow I also had to do 15 hours of flying with an FAA instructor, but I had that covered as I took one along as a safety pilot and could use the hours together for this. Also, I remember I had to have a long distance flight consisting of several legs and approaches. I had that as well already covered.

I have the fingerprint stuff done, all the hours, but now only need to do the 2 theory exams and the practical exam with the only FAA examiner in Europe.

However, I am not sure I will continue this route as a stand-alone FAA PPL/IR is not going to work anymore in Europe. You will always need to have an EASA license and medical as well, so the piggy bag method works just as fine.

EDLE, Netherlands

You still need FAA papers if flying an N-reg, anywhere.

The reasons for being on N-reg are another debate, of course....

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

Yes, but the FAA papers don't need to be based on a stand-alone license. I understand the advantages of having the aircraft based on the N-reg, but flying solely under FAA pilot license will not last, so having a stand-alone FAA license is not an advantage anymore. You just can go for the license validation process, which gives you the FAA license based on your EASA license. If the EASA license goes bust, then goes the FAA license. In the past you could have your EASA license go bust, but then you still could have your stand-alone FAA license on which you could fly in Europe. Since that option is going to be gone, I don't see the advantage of having your stand-alone FAA license anymore if you live and fly in Europe.

EDLE, Netherlands

Since that option is going to be gone, I don't see the advantage of having your stand-alone FAA license anymore if you live and fly in Europe.

The reason for getting the standalone is because, over the years, European based 61.75 holders have endured some massive hassles getting them re-issued following trivia like a change of address.

Whereas a standalone FAA PPL is valid for ever, nobody (except the FAA) can take it away from you, and to fly on it again (after not using it for e.g. years) you just need to get an FAA medical and the BFR. This is a far cry from the JAA/EASA system where after a few years you get screwed. Same comments for the FAA IR (an IPC, etc).

And finally the need for EASA pilot papers is based around the famous "operator based in the EU" wording which nobody has defined, nobody (in regulatory power) seems to be interested in defining, some national CAAs (Austria publicly, some others less publicly) are very uninterested in getting stuck into enforcing... so subject to having valid insurance I would say this remains a grey area and will probably do so for a long time especially if you can arrange for a non-EU "operator" (which is easy to do with a syndicate for example).

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

In Germany, lawyers have been trying (for the last 12 months) to find a foreign operator setup (for private flyers) that works. Absolutely in vain, AFAIK.

In a nutshell, even if there is no positive definition of "operator", there is just no way around the fact that, in a "private use scenario", the regular pilot also happens to be the person who "operates" the aircraft.

Mainz (EDFZ) & Egelsbach (EDFE), Germany

I don't think it is possible for the traditional sole owner-pilot.

I think most agree that the "operator" is whoever decides where the plane is going to fly on a given day etc.

This is why it should be possible with a syndicate operating under leasing/renting arrangement, where the plane is "operated" by a non EU based person or other entity, and anybody who wants to fly it has to ask the operator for permission e.g. book it via a booking website.

Obviously there might be a test case to decide whether this is valid but until that happens...

If this was a tax scenario then it might immediately be difficult, because most N European tax regimes will "pierce" any structure which is set up to reduce tax but has no commercial purpose - though there is plenty of grey area around that too e.g. firms locating "intellectual property" in low tax regimes and then paying that company the maximum possible money for using the IP

But the case of the syndicate is different because there is a clear commercial purpose for the booking website. The company who you ask for permission is, ahem, sir, based in Turkey......

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

The reason for getting the standalone is because, over the years, European based 61.75 holders have endured some massive hassles getting them re-issued following trivia like a change of address.

Having endured the massive hassles (had to switch my 61.75 basis from Australian to UK to overcome), this is also why I am planning on getting the standalone....which in hindsight, I should have done years ago in the first place...

I also mused on PPLIR that as a non-European citizen I could more credibly argue (on the ramp if necessary) that I am also not a resident....not sure what residency tests EASA would apply....although this is somewhat secondary...I may still apply for UK citizenship at some point anyway!

YPJT, United Arab Emirates

There are many private pilots whose residence will be unclear - as with tax.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

I also mused on PPLIR that as a non-European citizen I could more credibly argue (on the ramp if necessary) that I am also not a resident....not sure what residency tests EASA would apply.

If your intent is UK residency, that might indeed work because you won't have a national ID card. But in continental Europe, where if you have permanent residence legally you have a national ID card and a registered address, you have to be concerned about that. My plan would be (and eventually will be) to stay no longer than 90 days at a stretch in the EU. Good luck!

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