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Flying commercially

The last three months without a plane has been a wonderful reminder of how painful CAT is.

As we have discussed on here frequently, it is not always easy for people to fly themselves for work.

But the sheer amount of time you spend on the ground in shorthaul is the most noticeable thing for me. At least an hour before the flight, then the block time on the ground. Security etc.

Even slower piston singles could beat the true block time of the last few flights I have had.

Last Edited by JasonC at 08 Sep 17:34
EGTK Oxford

First and most of all, my sincere sympathy with your being planeless for so long. Most of us must have known the feeling at one time or another – I have, already twice, in my short and modest flying career.

Excuse me if it may seem a squibble of words, but I think that for most shorthaul travel a car beats any kind of plane. Shall we define shorthaul as “400 km or less” ? But even for the 500 or so kms from here to Frankfurt I would prefer to drive.

A few factors to take into consideration:

-) yes of course one looses a lot of time on airline travel, not the least on getting to/from the airports. But the airlines are incredible affordable these days, there must be something to make up for that.
-) if flying one’s self, only an IFR ticket will offer any decent kind of dispatch rate
-) aerodrome opening hours will further limit the liberty that one expects above all from having a private aircraft
-) time waiting at an airport, or waiting for a train, need not be time lost; many jobs can be done off-line such as composing mail and presentations. I am sure the more experienced business travellers get very good at this. The same goes for sitting in an airliner, or a train, as a passenger. As a driver or as a pilot, one is supposed to spare all attention for that job.
-) the ultimate deciding factor is total travel time door-to-door – your own car has the tremendous advantage of waiting at your door, plus it can usually be driven to the doorstep of your final destination.

For a strong counter-example, imagine myself getting NOW (midweek evening, close on sunset) a call for an urgent repair somewhere in Europe. “Get there as soon as ever you can manage and get the bugger to WORK”. Yes I do get calls of that kind, though sadly rarely (they imply carte blanche which is a very nice feeling). Living close to Brussels, I could grab some bare essentials (clean shirt, underwear, toothbrush …) jump in the car and be in Milano or Berlin or Prague tomorrow morning when the offices open, even have had a few precious hours of sleep somewhere along the road. For a few exceptional destinations (London, Lyon, …) high speed train would work best, either tonight or tomorrow early. Airline would be the prime choice for Barcelona or Dublin or Budapest or any place further away. But my own humble aeroplane would be the fastest for not one single destination, I could not take off before tomorrow morning anyway. I don’t believe the average Cessna or Mooney or Cirrus would score much better, though they have both more speed and greater range.

Last Edited by at 08 Sep 18:44
EBZH Kiewit, Belgium

We’re on the same page, Jason C.

My whole aircraft ownership saga serves one major purpose: to never have to fly commercial ever again. I’m not there yet, and probably never will be. But at least I’m a little bit closer to be able to do it for all domestic or North American jobs I need to get to. International will probably not happen, unless someone gives me the money for a P180 Avanti with extended range tanks or a 695 Commander. None of them to be had below $1M, sadly.

Commercial air travel has literally become the bane of my existence. I fly about 50-100 days a year, so as you can see it has me on the precipice of a nervous breakdown at times. Here in the US it’s worse with all the TSA bulls*it and the incessant hub system. You can’t get anywhere to anywhere direct, without changing a million planes and getting bussed around like sheep on some godforsaken airport out of your way. Good god how awful it is. Constant missed connections, delays, grumpy personnel, old planes (most of them have ash trays in the seats still), shitty airport chain food etc. Just one crammed sweatbox after another.

As for time saved, I found that anything up to 1000nm was quicker in the Aerostar vs. the airlines. With the new steed that’s a bit faster, I think that can probably stretch to 1200-1300nm. However, on the other end, a car would almost always be quicker up to 200-300nm, door to door. So there’s a sweet spot: 300-1200nm.

Last Edited by AdamFrisch at 08 Sep 18:56

When I was living in Texas, I figured in the club’s Beech Bonanza, I could beat the airlines easily on any trip up to 600nm (the basic unrefuelled IFR range) and some of the time beat them even with a fuel stop. My home airport was only 5 minutes from home and in much of the US there’s a GA airport closer to your final intended destination than there is an airline airport.

Andreas IOM

From where I live in east midland of England a recent trip to Dusseldorf by schedule would have taken about 5 hours door to to door but in my very trusty C172 it took 3 hours and had the advantage also of less hassle at the airport in Dusseldorf both for arrival and departure. Big cost difference of course but as 2 of us were going it was not so bad. The Jet Centre at Dusseldorf were just great with service and facilities.
Very different to you guys with and IR and a big expensive steed of course but terrific for me.

UK, United Kingdom

The last time I took an airline flight must have been at least 18 month ago. Flying with a general aviation plane will save you a lot of time and is more relaxing. But that will come at a price. Other means of transportation will usually be cheaper compared to any all weather GA travel. Only if you are ready to pay for your time, flexibility and comfort it will work out.

Living close to Brussels, I could grab some bare essentials (clean shirt, underwear, toothbrush …) jump in the car and be in Milano or Berlin or Prague tomorrow morning when the offices open, even have had a few precious hours of sleep somewhere along the road

With the GA plane you could sleep in your bed, get up early and be at most of those places the following morning much more relaxed than having driven all night. But it will not be cheap. You need a more expensive homebase with proper opening times, hard runway etc. You have to be prepared to land at more expensive city airports. You will be flying a more expensive aircraft.

Last Edited by Sebastian_G at 08 Sep 20:36
www.ing-golze.de
EDAZ

Sebastian_G wrote:

The last time I took an airline flight must have been at least 18 month ago.

I last flew with an airline three weeks ago. Going to my annual simulator refresher training, so that our customers can enjoy “private commercial flying” for another year I am glad that for a change I could sit in the back and have a chat with my seat neighbor and a free coffe. No way could I have made that trip quicker and with less effort by flying myself – not in “my” bizjet and certainly not in anything smaller and slower than that.

EDDS - Stuttgart

This is probably the one area in which I can truly claim to be an expert. I fly a ridiculous amount of CAT every year – 120+ flights per year; a mix of long and short-haul. If I didn’t enjoy simply being in the air (even if I’m not PIC), I would probably hate it. There is little to recommend it these days.

EGTT, The London FIR

No way could I have made that trip quicker and with less effort by flying myself – not in “my” bizjet and certainly not in anything smaller and slower than that.

I get you couldn’t have done it cheaper, but quicker?

You could have flown direct to Farnborough. I bet you could have done it quicker. I agree about the relaxing bit but I enjoy flying myself but I guess it isn’t my job.

My earlier post was followed by arrival into Heathrow with an immigration hall that looked like the Hungarian border. I have never seen such a long queue in the UK.

EGTK Oxford

On top of flying (myself) an airline for work, I get the joyful experience of being a passenger about 3 times a fortnight. Sometimes it is nice to sit in the back for a change, but I would definitely prefer to fly myself to work (financially I could – my passenger flights are short but required due to water in between) if not for the dispatch rate problem (couldn’t afford a high dispatch rate aeroplane!)

I consider myself outgoing and a people person. However the one thing I would remove from airports and airplanes if I could to make it a much nicer experience would by far be people

United Kingdom
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