AFAIK it is similar in all Australian capital cities.....so Us Aussies shouldnt have too much of a go at the UK!
Yes but the difference is that each Australian State has essentially one big CTR then nothing.
In general I think the only thing that matters is the class of the airspace. All other things like airway, TMA and similar are only confusing. The airspace class tells me what I am allowed to do or not.
I still remember when I first got my first UK VFR chart and it took me a while until I figured out that unfamiliar airspace structure...
Concerning the training environment also here in Germany I have got flight instructors who have been afraid to talk on the radio. Then there are the part time airline captains who teach that ATC is at your service and that you should request what you need.
The more you practice at least here you can get nearly any clearance. If the controller thinks that you can be trusted to comply with your clearnce in a professional way you can do formation low approaches at controlled airfields, photo missions in a CTR, traffic patterns at international airports etc. Many controllers here fly themselves so as long as it is safe they will do what they can for you.
It may not necessarily be the fault of the UK PPL training establishment, but rather the "fault" of the UK airspace design in itself.
++1. How stupid it is to have a IFR-only low-level airway. What a waste of airspace.
++1. How stupid it is to have a IFR-only low-level airway. What a waste of airspace.
This is one of my personal grievances. The Class A airspace around me starts at 3,000ft, and without particularly good reason, IMHO.
When vectored this way, which is not that often, the aircraft using this bit of Class A are between 16 and 25 track miles from the runway and will still be above 4,000 ft even by the time they reach the CTR a couple of miles away (which is Class D).
In reality, they are usually very much higher than this - the Ryanair Stuka. In fact, one has just come past me now at 5,500ft with approximately 16 track miles to run.
Almost nobody, except helicopters, flies below 1,000ft, and very few want to risk a no-tea, no-biscuits chat with the CAA for busting Class A and so they avoid flying close to the lower-limit.
The combined effect means that VFR traffic is forced into a narrow band between 1,000ft and 2,500ft. Meanwhile the Class A airspace is completely empty most of the time. This seems mad.
By all means have CAS, but Class A at low level really is excessive in most cases.
While I am on my soapbox: I have noticed that several ATSUs seem to treat their CTR as though it were Class A airspace. I overheard a GA pilot argue about ATC's right to exclude him from their Class D, so they allowed him enter, put him on a Radar Control Service and then had him orbit for 20 minutes.
As JasonC said...
the UK approach that GA really should bumble around at 1500ft while the professionals use the flight levels.
I flew Airways once on a training sortie, and in real IMC. It was an eye-opener and some of the easiest flying I have ever done.
This one flight taught me two things: I like flying as high as possible (there was nobody else up there), and I want an IR because without it, dodging around Class A CAS in the UK is a pain.
I think the airspace shapes are based on published SIDs/STARs (which won't be operated unless the radars fail, which is practically never, because airport capacity would collapse if the system went procedural, so there are various backups) and on missed approach paths (which do get used occasionally).
I overheard a GA pilot argue about ATC's right to exclude him from their Class D, so they allowed him enter, put him on a Radar Control Service and then had him orbit for 20 minutes.
The pilot should have MORd that, because every UK Class D unit is supposed to file a regular report to the CAA detailing cases of refused transits and reasons why each one was refused.
I want an IR because without it, dodging around Class A CAS in the UK is a pain.
Sadly, an IR won't help access to the London TMA. London Control won't let you anywhere near it - except at defined crossing routes which tend to be around FL100. The way they normally work it is they give you a climb on a path well away from the LTMA (typically to the east or west i.e. parallel to the LGW/LHR traffic streams) and once you are ~ FL100 then you get sent north or south as desired. What you can do is e.g. this but not below FL100. Consequently most IR holders hack around the UK in low level Class G, unless they can do a decent long run to make it worth flying higher.
The pilot should have MORd that, because every UK Class D unit is supposed to file a regular report to the CAA detailing cases of refused transits and reasons why each one was refused.
It seems to occasionally crop up that controllers decide to invent rules. Now I've encountered surly controllers in the US where I used to live, but they'd never invent rules - they might give you a clearance into class B airspace grudgingly, but they never would invent rules on the fly.
Gloucester once refused to let a friend of mine depart until he filed a flight plan because he was crossing water (but not an FIR boundary). The thing is there's no point arguing because these kind of people tend to then be vindictive and if you fly in their airspace frequently will make your life difficult.
(Note I'm not ragging on them all, the vast majority of the time controllers in the UK are perfectly pleasant to deal with and entirely reasonable).
There are airways in the Scottish FIR which a PPL+IMCr holder could use due to them being class D, although there usage might be limited. The main one springing to mind would be the P600 which is class D from the NI/ROI border up to west of Fife. Can't remember the levels off hand but I believe a decent portion of it at least is from FL55. I assume in theory that these could be flown VFR if ATC agrees with you but I have never tried it.
I did a decent bit of flying in Portugal last year and noticed that the attitude is much more relaxed. Never asked for a transit and never was told to remain clear of a CTR/CTA etc (was once or twice asked to avoid a TRA if I could due military activity). The general idea there seemed to be that, after having filed your flight plan (a requirement), once you called up anywhere en route (be it Porto, Lisbon, Faro) they just told you to get on it it. As an example route from North of Lisbon to LPPM inside the Faro TMA (Class C).
P: Lisboa Approach GABCD
A: GABCD Lisboa Approach identified QNH 1010 route and profile to Portimao
and you would get handed to information once clear of lisbon and similarly on initial contact with Faro when approaching their TMA:
P: Faro Approach GABCD
A: GABCD Faro Approach QNH 1010 report Portimao in sight
This was somewhat strange for me at first as having flown only in the UK previous to this I felt initially uncomfortable at the lack of an explicit clearance.
All spon on. Across european counties, very different towards their controlled airspaces (C and D) exist. In some countries like UK, Germany or Italy, controllers tend to give lots of priority to IFR traffic and when they do clear VFR to cross, they have just been grantes a huge excptiomal priviledge. In these countries, VFR pilots can ask for clearance, but need to habe a plan B in mind in case the controller says "niet".
On the other had, countries like France or the scandinavian countries are much more open to VFR. Their controller's attitude is more like "you (VFR pilot) will fly your filed/requested routing and I will organize my airspace accordingly.
Sweden is either C or G, and mostly G. Not a lot of controlled airspace up in Lappland...
All these airspace classes calls for confusion. They should just simplify it to either controlled or not controlled. In controlled airspace you fly in IMC, even if it's actually VMC. In uncontrolled you fly VMC or you don't fly.
Simple, but no, gotta have A-Z, and slight differences such as IFR separated from IFR and VFR, except on tuesdays or if the controller is taking a leak in which case IFR is separated from VFR but not IFR unless the pilot actually sees where he is going...
P: Lisboa Approach GABCD
A: GABCD Lisboa Approach identified QNH 1010 route and profile to Portimao
How refreshing. Compare that to Norwich the other day; VFR arrival with a student [I like to do at least one class D join, and one MATZ or Class D transit or similar during PPL training, so the PPL is comfortable with this when they qualify]
The student and I had a good laugh about this. Departure was similarly silly.
a few seconds later,
[Note] Keswick Roundabout is directly south of the airport, a right turn onto track south misses it by a few miles.
Did not really help the poor pilot, did it? Instead of asking again, he just departed south and then turned toward the point outside the CTR.
This mission achieved its primary objective - the student did fly his QXC to Norwich the next day, and does not think Class D is a big deal.
But it also taught him that this all can be rather silly... probably have to take him to LTQ to have him experience how it works elsewhere...
