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New Member - SkyWagon from Turkey

More thread drift, sorry Peter…

Robert, super article, thanks for the link. A great summary of the facts. A few more details; the first AD was rescinded because a number of shops, including the one I worked for at the time, pointed out that we were doing more damage doing the inspection, than what we were finding. It seems that the FAA listened. So when Embry Riddle lost the wing, the situation brought back memories of the inspection.

“Removing the wings” is not the hard part, it’s removing the bolts through the spar – it’s a misery job! There’s no access for any meaningful inspection with the wing bolts in, to inspect, they must be removed. With the bolts out, eddy current inspection is pretty straight forward. And, with the bolts out, the wings come off with not a lot more work. But, yes, it will be necessary to support the fuselage.

The elephant in the hangar will be, what if a defect is found upon inspection, is a replacement wing available? I was recently asked to consider some work with a Piper Seminole. This work was associated with a wing replacement. I recall my client saying that replacement Seminole wings were multi hundred thousand dollars. I have not heard about PA-28 parts, I will listen with interest…

In the mean time, to further drift the thread… PA-28’s are not the only type suffering spar concerns. The cantilever Cessna 210’s, and to a lesser degree 177’s, are the subject of onerous spar inspections. A 210 lost a wing, and resulting fatal accident last spring. I recently concurred the failure of a C 210G spar, which I ask the owner to arrange for us to inspect. We found the required replacement part used, and had all inspections accomplished on it. I’ll be designing the procedure to change out the spar. Upon my inquiry, a Cessna service center tells me that a new replacement spar for the 210 from Cessna will be more than US$80,000, and made to order (long lead time).

So, know the type issues before a used plane purchase. Cessna 172’s, 182’s and 206’s also have inspections on the horizon.

So aging aircraft are a concern, replacement parts will be a greater concern….

Home runway, in central Ontario, Canada, Canada
Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

pilot_DAR you are confirming my faith in the eternal youth elixir steel tube and fabric american classics (Canadian if you count the Fleet Canucks) :)

Oxford (EGTK), United Kingdom

So should I concern about a PA28 younger than 15 years old in terms of " aging aircraft are a concern, replacement parts will be a greater concern…"

Last Edited by SkyWagon at 09 Dec 16:32
Fly , Cycle and Run
LTBJ,LTFB, Turkey

I was very concerned about flying a vintage pa28 and posted about it. See https://www.euroga.org/forums/hangar-talk/9195-wing-comes-off-a-pa28-during-a-checkride-with-an-examiner-and-wing-spar-structure-discussion/post/224879#224879

It is extremely rare for a spar to break, but the ERAU accident made lots of waves as it was accepted that their planes are new, well maintained and safe. Out of the tens of thousands of Pipers made, how many had a spar failure during normal maneuvers? A handful?

To me the „wing breaks off“ accident profile seems to fit aircraft accumulating a lot of hours in an abusive training environment in a short timeframe (thereby undergoing less calendar time based checks)?!

When you buy a PA28, you risk a wing spar AD, but I doubt it will be some brutal „your plane is worthless“ type. So, better said: if you buy ANY plane, you risk a wing spar ad.

always learning
LO__, Austria

Pilot_DAR wrote:

Upon my inquiry, a Cessna service center tells me that a new replacement spar for the 210 from Cessna will be more than US$80,000, and made to order

You can buy two replacement wings for 7-8k pretty easily. I have 210 wings and would be over the moon to sell them. If by spar you mean carry through spar I sold one for 5k to Steve’s Aircraft not that long ago.

SkyWagon wrote:

So should I concern about a PA28 younger than 15 years old in terms of " aging aircraft are a concern, replacement parts will be a greater concern…"

You can buy almost anything you need in short order if you know where to look.

Buying, Selling, Flying
EISG, Ireland

I think you need to be N-reg for this to work. The rules for transplanting parts on an EASA-reg are horrendous.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

Returning to the topic of Turkey, I found flying IFR there extremely easy, ATC very competent and friendly with practically any request fulfilled in a matter of seconds. Besides some GPS jamming in the south close to Cyprus and Syrian border, everything else seems to be great in their airspace. However, the weather can be challenging and capability of flying high (above FL140) is very nice to have.

LDZA LDVA, Croatia

Emir wrote:

Besides some GPS jamming in the south close to Cyprus and Syrian border, everything else seems to be great in their airspace.

We are having this problem at specific areas and sometimes unable to make RNP approaches due to chart limitation. Other than that it is not as it used to be, we are having more direct routes than before, Military ATC units are also so cooperative.

Last Edited by SkyWagon at 11 Dec 06:32
Fly , Cycle and Run
LTBJ,LTFB, Turkey

Military ATC units are also so cooperative.

Military ATC allowed me crossing their airport areas on several occasions without any problem and without changing the altitude or heading.

LDZA LDVA, Croatia
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