I’m glad I haven’t landed there recently. Otherwise, I would suspect the rule was made up for me!!! :)
Megara winds can be wicked. I suspect this came about because the guys in the tower were witness to some doozy landings…
As regards enforcement, they probably can guess that at 20 knots x wind component, you’re at/above the demonstrated limit for most planes. My Rallye is 20 knots; as a low wing handles x-winds much better than a Cessna.
What if you request to land diagonally along/across the runway?
The runways seem wide enough that a Super Cub should never have a crosswind problem, I also note they anticipated this by not listing the type :)
This discussion reminds me of the problems at La Mole St Tropez airport. There is, or at least to be, a limit on wind speed for landing, something like 20 kts. And of course everyone figured out how to game the system.
St Tropez Airport is genuinely quite tricky, tucked into a tight little valley with a 90 degree bend right after takeoff heading west, or even worse a 90 bend left on short final heading east. In the summer it can get quite windy in the afternoons.
Anyway, here is the trick. During the approach the tower would tell you the wind. If it was over limit the pilot would circle overhead and then keep asking for a wind update. As the wind is very gusty there sooner or later tower would report a number below that limit and say cleared to land. At that point the pilot says “confirm, wind 270 degrees, 17 kts” and then be very careful not to ask again and indeed not speak again and proceed with landing. It seemed the tower controllers and the pilots all understood this scheme.
petakas wrote:
Yes .. lack of A4 paper, ink cartridges, PC’s on Internet, not to mention WC paper and other amenities (supplied gracefully by based operators …)
Goes to show …
Phew.
Reading your very comprehensive report (thanks for that!) it appears that the Military would be perfectly happy to close the field for civil traffic which was imposed on them by the CAA after mucking up Marathon as well as the old LGAT airport.
So what are the chances that they will simply take their airfield back and tell GA to take a hike as they do not have ressources, don’t get paid and promises have been broken by the CAA. You’d have 100 airplanes homeless. Yet, Athens does not have a full GA airport even as it stands, as Megara lacks AOE status.
Looking at Google Maps, LGAT is still sitting there a waste of space in the middle of the city. Some of the runways have been built over, but if I am not mistaken the southern parts of the runways are still very much usable. Come to that, they have a huge apron totally laying to waste.
So why did GA not want to move there? It is close to the city and it does not have a cumbersone co-owner. Obviously, in order to keep separation from traffic going to LGAV they would have to limit the height you can fly there to about 1000 ft or so, but for VFR that would be more than enough. Apart, they do have customs at LGAV as well as at the Harbours nearby. And if I am not mistaken, the caa is living on the premises?
So theoretically, old LGAT could be revived with a dual 1000m runway on the southern part, an apron which could host most of Greek GA with absolute ease and a terminal which may need dusting off sufficiently to allow for an FBO to receive, handle and dispatch GA traffic. Would it be an alternative to LEMG for Athens GA?
Or what is the airfield near the Olympic Village there for? Also Military? As Elevsis? So 3 military bases and none of them have capacity to take on GA?
The truth is, it’s no fun landing when your xwind component is at the POH limit, so unless you have no choice (ignored the TAFs, or they were too optimistic), the rule isn’t that onerous, given that you can land if inbound.
This statement is simply not true. The number in the POH has little to do with the capability of the aircraft, and it is as has been said many tomes NOT A LIMIT AT ALL.
And it is onerous as for many types the limit is much much lower than what the aircraft is comfortably capable of.
I cannot understand how after thos being pointed out so many times on this or other threads people still believe this nonsense.
The max demo crosswind number is even less relevant for departures, not least because, with a big runway, you can depart on a slight diagonal.
The airfield northwest is Tatoi LGTT.
Its a military (Air Force this time) base for the basic training of future air force pilots.
It has curfew type restrictions on operations with no flights during (city) siesta hours and no flights in weekdays till early pm due to air force cadets training.
So basically its a weekend only operation for based GA.
They allow in only aeroathletic airclubs being based as a public (AirForce) service to aeroathletism.
Approval to get based there may take several years.
So some ~30 GA aircraft and sailplanes are based there but they are clubs who participate in aero rallies of FAI etc.
Old Hellenikon LGAT is Greece’s most expensive landplot.
It is already in progress to become Athens’s mini Dubai type of cityscape.
https://thehellinikon.com/en/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hellenikon_Metropolitan_Park
The works are starting in the following months.
All of us had the same thought with you but the stakes were high and its destiny (as a downtown city airport) was already doomed from the beginning, it had no chance.
It was just too valuable nowadays for the state to “waste” the site for a GA airport.
To the southwest, Elefsis LGEL is Air Force’s air transport/logistics command and they are not keen on letting GA in. Its a very busy (non combat) Air Force base.
The basic reason of Athens having limited choices for GA airfield is that its a city surrounded by mountains. They leave little room for free plains of uninhabited land to provide space for an airfield. Marathon LGMR until 2001 was the best ever site but it got sacrificed for the Olympics.
Here are the options and the closed/disused ones around Athens http://hellasga.com/gallery/kyp/athens
@Cobalt19-Jan-20 06:05 26
“This statement is simply not true. The number in the POH has little to do with the capability of the aircraft, and it is as has been said many tomes NOT A LIMIT AT ALL.”
Should I be concerned with my own capabilities, or is that not a limit at all?
Do you have a limit? Is it 2x the POH number? 3x? 100 knots? Or are crosswinds irrelevant?
I agree on departures you can compensate, but do you guys really and truly take off at any wind level? The question is serious.
Hmm, people don’t trust their own abilities in making a dead stick landing and would rather pull the chute than glide down to a runway. But, when it comes to cross wind landings everybody are all of a sudden expert test pilots showing the finger to the POH 
