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What exactly causes Eurocontrol tracking to start and end?

In this example, the flight was handed over (by Lille) to London Info (area FIS) instead of London Control

This terminates the IFR clearance (as far as the UK is concerned). We have had many discussions on this – example example – but I am wondering what exactly arranges for Eurocontrol to stop tracking the flight. There was a change of transponder code to 1177, but would that alone do it? One often gets txp code changes on IFR flights and the tracking doesn’t break. The tracking stopped when I was handed over to London Info, and stopped probably very quickly after that point.

I wonder if any ATCO here knows how this works.

It almost looks like ATC “presses a button” to stop the tracking but I am sure there is no such button.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

London Info didn’t put the 1177 squawk in the EuroControl squawk coordination database, and so EuroControl didn’t have the information that this squawk was the same flight?

ELLX

lionel wrote:

London Info didn’t put the 1177 squawk in the EuroControl squawk coordination database, and so EuroControl didn’t have the information that this squawk was the same flight?

I also believe that’s the reason… happened to me few times in Turkey when changing squawk arriving from Greece.

LDZA LDVA, Croatia

Perhaps there are several possible „triggers“. I have had two recent IFR flights into VFR-only airfields. In both cases I cancelled IFR about 10-15nm from destination, yet autorouter shows my track up to turning base leg for landing.

I believe that I was not given a squawk change in the first case. In the second case, I‘m pretty sure that the squawk changed to VFR/7000 at IFR cancellation, simply because that is standard terminology when cancelling IFR in Switzerland.

Last Edited by chflyer at 27 Sep 12:18
LSZK, Switzerland

When I read the question, it occurred to me: “when you reach the edge of the earth.”

Home runway, in central Ontario, Canada, Canada

It is possible that there is a range of valid squawks configured at IFPS and once one of these is no longer seen, the tracking stops. It would be a weird way to implement it though – it would rely on each country diligently updating that database.

OTOH if the squawks are issued by IFPS itself, that would explain it. I think they are, because the Autorouter used to for a time tell you the squawk – until certain countries objected to that (the UK mainly, I believe).

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

for Eurocontrol to stop tracking the flight.

Is it for billing purposes?

As it’s also possible to be given 1177 but then later to renegotiate a clearance back into the Class A, so does tracking resume after that?

Last Edited by James_Chan at 30 Sep 14:26

Is it for billing purposes?

Interesting Q. I am below 2T so don’t actually know but I think Eurocontrol billing is done on the great circle distance of what you filed. So cancelling IFR, or “dropping out of the system” doesn’t help.

A well known UK pilot, over 2T, once posted suggesting that doing a touch and go at some airfield and flying “VFR” from there on is a good solution From vague memory, the example given was something like La Rochelle – Biggin Hill, with a T&G at Shoreham. Instead of paying route charges on 313nm you pay them on 281nm. Whether this is worth the hassle of flying VFR in some weird airspace, having to check enroute notams, RAs, etc, is another matter.

I am sure a big part of why < 2T is not being billed is exactly that: most of the traffic would be flying “VFR” i.e. illegal VFR.

later to renegotiate a clearance back into the Class A, so does tracking resume after that?

Based on this it certainly can do.

That’s a bad example for route charges because if I was over 2T, I would be billed for the whole EGHE-EGKA flight because it was filed as “I” even though most of it is in Class G and without any “IFR service”, so actually flying that on an IFR FP would be delivering the “FL100 option” (desirable to get above wx) at a very high cost. Consequently I am damn sure very few people fly > 2T planes “overtly IFR” if most of the flight is in Class G.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

Peter wrote:

I am below 2T so don’t actually know but I think Eurocontrol billing is done on the great circle distance of what you filed. So cancelling IFR

@Peter, does that mean if I fly 2.5T a/c from EGTR Elstree to EGPF Glasgow on the eastern route (mostly OCAS) and I’m dropped out of CAS shortly after London TMA ends (as it usually happens) then I’ll have to pay for the whole route? Even if the services not provided for the most part?

EGTR

Based on all I’ve read for years, I think so, but I really must leave this to somebody who flies above 2000kg.

EDIT: here you go. Not a full answer though; I posted a question at the end.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom
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