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Farnborough Controlled Airspace Proposal

Is there a diagram somewhere? I see this local copy and there are several diagrams in the huge PDF.

TMZs are a great solution. They mostly p1ss off the “civil liberties” pilots who want to be invisible, and who will mostly have to install a Mode S box which then radiates their reg. I am sure that the vast % of deliberately nontransponding aircraft in the 1000-2000ft band helped to make the case for this extra CAS…

The EASA ban on new Mode C installations (except to replace a Mode C box of the same type) played into the hands of Farnborough etc.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

The diagram is on page 46.

Spare a thought for the gliders, balloons etc. GA isn’t just TB21s.

EGKB Biggin Hill

I am based at Blackbushe, who I am led to believe have not objected to the proposal. I wonder why.

The lower third of Blackbushe the ATZ becomes Class D. All circuits are to the south at present to avoid the built up areas of Yateley, Blackwater, and Eversley. This will mean very tight circuits to avoid Class D (not likely to happen with students) or changing the pattern to the north side which is noise sensitive.

MIG alley (the E to W corridor) airspace between Heathrow and Gatwick will require a clearance to get into it as again the class D will block access to it. Taking off from Blackbushe and heading E from 07 will give you only a few seconds to negotiate a clearance before reaching Class D airspace. No chance in summer with the Farnborough 125.25 frequency usually jammed up.

Going South it’s very bad as well. If you don’t get a clearance to cross Class D you have to route around the edge of the CAS right over the top of Lasham, one of the busiest gliding sights in the country. This is then followed by entry into Class E TMZ. If you don’t have a Transponder you are effectively not able to get into the corridor between Gatwick and Southampton.

The complexity of this airspace is asking for trouble.

Is it any wonder that visiting foreign pilots find the UK too difficult.

This is going to make my already complicated flying even more so. The workload at take off will be very high. Maybe I need an IR which would make it easier.

How long will it be before Biggin Hill decide they need to cut off a big chunk of airspace to accommodate jet traffic and remove GA completely, just like Farnborough. You then completely cut off Redhill and Fairoaks as they have Class D to cross in both directions to get into the open FIR.

EGLK

Fairly obviously there will have to be a procedure whereby a rapid (or pre-agreed) clearance can be obtained for CAS entry.

Farnborough has relatively little traffic – 50k ceiling according to one doc I found – and unlike most GA airfields it will not be concentrated when the sun is shining. So getting into the CAS should be easy IF it is suitably organised.

Spare a thought for the gliders, balloons etc

Gliders can be visible too (I would have Mode C if I was gliding, and many already have) and I doubt many baloons would be flown close to the Gatwick CTR.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

Peter wrote:

TMZs are a great solution. They mostly p1ss off the “civil liberties” pilots who want to be invisible

I don’t think there are that many ‘civil liberties’ pilots around.

I would love to see a lot of almost empty Class D airspace changed to Class E with a TMZ. It would also help sell electronic conspicuity because everyone wins that way: GA pilots win because they gain access to airspace by installing Mode S (and ATC can’t refuse them access to class E), and the airports get a known traffic environment, and anyone who doesn’t want to have a Mode-S transponder has lost nothing. There are more good options for Mode S transponders than there were, say, just 5 years ago, including options that are becoming a lot more reasonably priced and can be fitted to instrument panels which lack space (e.g. the stuff from Trig with the 2.5in instrument hole head, with the actual transponder tucked away elsewhere) and have lower power demands. (I’ve just bought a Garmin GTX 335, it consumes less power than the Mode C transponder it’s going to replace, and it’s a ‘full featured’ Mode-S transponder).

There was some talk from the CAA about doing this to some of Doncaster’s vast empty Class D airspace. I hope it becomes a reality.

Last Edited by alioth at 12 Jul 10:13
Andreas IOM

Colin wrote:

I am based at Blackbushe, who I am led to believe have not objected to the proposal. I wonder why.

The lower third of Blackbushe the ATZ becomes Class D. All circuits are to the south at present to avoid the built up areas of Yateley, Blackwater, and Eversley. This will mean very tight circuits to avoid Class D (not likely to happen with students) or changing the pattern to the north side which is noise sensitive.

Blackbushe probably expect to put in place an LoA that allows circuit traffic. After all Fairoaks is already almost entirely in the London CTR, and we do circuits on the north side as much as on the south side.

EGTF, LFTF

On civil liberties
It’s ok for streets to be closed for demonstrations and protests, but how long would one’s licence last if we took direct action in Heathrow’s approach path?

EGHP-LFQF-KCLW

I don’t think there are that many ‘civil liberties’ pilots around.

Fly around the souff of England for a bit, with TCAS

But maybe some of them don’t know how to turn on the TXP. One funny one was me departing for EGHE a few days ago. A TB20 departed immediately before me. He was not showing up, which obviously concerned me and in the haze neither of us could spot him, so I called ATC and asked if he has his TXP on. That led to him showing up, but Mode A. I left it at that… don’t want to upset people without a good reason. A bit later as he approached Solent CAS (we were both going the same direction) they told him his altitude is not showing up, so he turned on Mode C. AFAIK he has a GTX330

I would love to see a lot of almost empty Class D airspace changed to Class E with a TMZ

I agree, but a TMZ would need to be bigger than the present CAS, so I think if you posted that on one of the UK sites, you would get a reception similar to walking into a church and saying that virgin mary got pregnant via casual sex

This discussion was done before e.g. here but I remain convinced that the UK GA resistance to visibility (often embedded in pilots’ heads during PPL training, and very evidently so too) or, in a few cases, resistance to spending any money on a plane which is only just hanging together on a shoestring, plays a big part in this new-CAS stuff. I have been flying there for 18 years and I reckon Farnborough radar sees at most 50% of the powered GA traffic flying around there. Now some people will claim this is a UK-only thing but actually it is widespread within certain GA sub-communities in certain other countries, where people operate wholly under the radar and certainly without Mode S to avoid FR24.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

I was closely involved in the early discussions and in the objections/responses.

The absence of representation from Blackbushe and Fairoaks management was noted and discussed at the time. Many theories, some of them conspiracy theories, were raised.

One was that Blackbushe wanted to focus on light jet IFR, and depended on Farnborough co-operation. Another was that, at the time, the manager of one airport knew more about fire engines than aeroplanes and the manager of the other had a close personal relationship with Farnborough ATM.

But only they know.

On the other hand, loads of based schools, clubs and individuals did object.

EGKB Biggin Hill

To quote Flyer regarding outcome of the ACP:

AOPA UK has not commented.

I find that more than a bit disappointing.

Fly safely
Various UK. Operate throughout Europe and Middle East, United Kingdom
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