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Greek Airports (being sold to FRAPORT in Germany) and many new problems

boscomantico wrote:

I don’t know. I think you underestimate how stupid they might be.

That’s general a observation of mine. Many times where I (or somebody else) was charged too much I asked myself if it was done on purpose or not. And very often, it turned out that it was a sheer oversight. Too much und too quick information nowadays. So, these days, I tend to generally not allege ill intent. Errare humanum est. That’s just life.

I had an odd experience at AERO Friedrichshafen this year. Parking is charged per 24 hours, of which one is included in the “handling package”. We had arrived at about 20:00 LT and planned to leave at about 16:00 LT two days later. When we got the bill, we had been charged for two additional 24-hour periods, not one. I though that it would be enough point out the mistake, but the agent insisted that the bill was correct. A strange discussion followed. I didn’t quite get the agent’s reasoning, but it was something to do with us having been there “three days” which was of course correct if you counted calendar days. I suspect she had tacitly assumed that we had arrived in the morning without checking our actual landing time. Eventually I convinced her that she got it wrong and she – very visibly annoyed – made up a new bill.

ESKC (Uppsala/Sundbro), Sweden

Yes, I have had that (airports wanting to charge 3 “nights”, or 3 “24-hour periods” if arriving day A and leaving day C) several times, too. It is almost comic what kind of discussions you get out of these things. Depending on my current mood (and time), I then decide whether it is worth discussing any further, and often just leave it as it is. But when I am in a “good” mood, then it sometimes evolves for some interesting human interaction… :-)

Anyway, a bit off-topic I am afraid. Might be worth a separate thread…

Last Edited by boscomantico at 20 May 13:27
Mainz (EDFZ) & Egelsbach (EDFE), Germany

petakas wrote:

Yes, then this then is a HANDLER’s mistake.
In such cases they reimburse the mistake to the account IBAN you will give them.

I emailed the SkyServ station manager, pointing him to the Fraport document above and my invoice and asking to make recalculation. He wrote he had forwarded it to the accounting department. But then nothing happened.
This weekend I visited LGRP again. SkyServ presented me another invoice with the same amounts. I argued it was incorrect and showed them the resolution of Fraport. First of all, they never heard of it (they said so)! I couldn’t believe it. Then they called someone from Fraport and then noted that the reduced landing fee is applicable only in case of a technical stop. I re-read the document and could not find anything about that in the text. They could not get me any contact of Fraport to whom I could address my questions. I did not have time for further discussions and had to pay the invoice as it was.

@petakas, what would you recommend me to do to resolve this situation? (It’s not even the matter of money but rather the matter of principle.) Maybe, contact AOPA Greece and ask for their help? I’m a member of AOPA Greece.

LCPH, Cyprus

Yes contact AOPA Hellas and they should be able to help somehow.

LGMG Megara, Greece

So, what is the advice for an international airport in Central-to-Eastern Greece now, in terms of least hassle (in terms of opening hours, necessity for slots, airport-to-overnight hotel, etc) and reasonable cost? I need Jet A1 (not Avgas) I’d arrive in the evening from Serbia (cheap fuel) and depart in the morning to Israel. These airports are approved for Israel, and within my range:

  • LGAV Athens
  • LGRP Rodos
  • LGKO Kos
  • LGIR Iraklion
  • LGMK Mikonos

Alternatively, I could use Burgas or Varna in Bulgaria…

ELLX

The airports approved for Israel are all privatized.
With the exception of LGAV all the rest are FRAPORTed.
The cheapest of all is LGAV (in comparison to FRAPORT costs) and has all you need, port of entry, all fuel types, H24 operation and is VFR friendly (no night VFR in Greece) even if it has lots of IFR commercial traffic.
HANDLER takes care of all, contact your handler of choice for coordination, they are good in English comm’s in email.

www.aopa.gr/Info for all the information you need.
Paragraph 12.b has all the details for handling.

Notify them early because PPR approval is a “hot” subject even for short visits, with lots of demand.

LGMG Megara, Greece

The airports approved for Israel are all privatized.

Are you sure about LGIR – it used to be state owned… or I mixed something?

LDZA LDVA, Croatia

Apologies, yes LGIR is CAA.
So yes its a bit cheaper than FRAPORT but VERY busy in summer (PPR is a risk).
Its has fuel and is port of entry/exit.

LGMG Megara, Greece

Recent report is that LGIR has no 100LL anymore. I think it was posted here…

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

I only went through LGKR as a passenger but frankly the standard of that airport is a breakfast any self respecting dog would refuse.

On arrival ONE racetrack for baggage mixed of 4 flights, buggies were not delivered at the airplane but dumped into the arrival hall again mixed from 4 flights. Terminal is in a state of disrepair. On departure very weird security procedures, 2x passport checks (Apparently Schengen is definitly dead there) and then passengers were let out on the heated tarmac of 34 degrees C for over 20 minutes before the bus turned up…

IMHO FRAPORT has not done anything to bring the airports to standard and have no reason whatsoever to behave like medeival landlords outpricing whomever they don’t want. I did not see any difference to the conditions in LGIR, which also was appalling the last 2 years for an airport with that traffic.

My temptation to fly to Greece on my own plane has definitly reached to below zero with these experiences. Fraport should be ashamed and get their act together but certainly not charge fantasy prices for airports vastly inferior even to the standards of small regional fields elsewhere.

LSZH(work) LSZF (GA base), Switzerland
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