Peter wrote:
Don’t Boeing pay compensation to the airlines?
There will be an insurance policy somewhere to cover it. Possibly not a 250 quid exces, but still……
BeechBaby wrote:
Has that been recent? If so the effect is already being felt. All of us will eventually pay for this corporate mess. I realise some paid with their lives which is totally unforgivable, but as with the banks, all of us pay financially for these decisions made by Corporate boards.
Yes, this year has seen a huge change.
JasonC wrote:
Sometimes doubling for lower risk.
That is a fair whack…..
Is there any evidence that Boeing have a product liability insurance and are claiming on it?
At this stage, they might be able to claim the compensation they are paying to their customers, only.
A lot of really big companies self insure.
The two crashes are likely to cost insurers $450M which is nothing on the scale of the industry.
This suggests $8BN loss to Boeing, but what (if any) connection is there with insurance?
Peter wrote:
Is there any evidence that Boeing have a product liability insurance and are claiming on it?
I do not have any information on that, but I would be surprised if they had not. The situation is a bit more complex however. Airlines are putting more pilots into front seat positions with less and less hours on type. The Atlas 767 being the latest where the Captain had 25 hours on type, FO brand new. Ploughed it into a lake. We have the Boeing MAX situation. Like economies, insurance companies dislike risk and shock. The industry is going through a patch of both. Result, premiums being hiked up to cover not only recent events but future proof.
The Boeing CEO was covering his share price and when it all got too hot he was expendable. Boeing could not afford to sustain the losses currently being experienced and until the FAA either clears the MAX, or grounds it, uncertainty is the status quo.
BeechBaby wrote:
I do not have any information on that, but I would be surprised if they had not. The situation is a bit more complex however. Airlines are putting more pilots into front seat positions with less and less hours on type. The Atlas 767 being the latest where the Captain had 25 hours on type, FO brand new. Ploughed it into a lake. We have the Boeing MAX situation. Like economies, insurance companies dislike risk and shock. The industry is going through a patch of both. Result, premiums being hiked up to cover not only recent events but future proof.
The stated reason for the turbine price hikes is the Boeing situation as well as a large number of other significant loss events. Someone is claiming on the insurance for the Boeing problem. It doesn’t matter who – Boeing, airlines, families of passengers – but all be claiming on their insurers and the losses will affect us all.
I doubt much of the B737Max loss will get into GA, although the numbers are gigantic (same as “war risk”, most airliners required state money until 2014, while GA pays peanut to cover this), also lot of insurance risk has been factored in past years premiums (roughly 4bn/year) where a big part of it accounted for risk from “new fleet” (e.g. A320Neo & B737Max to new Leap-X engines but at least it happened on 500 aircraft rather than 5000)
JasonC wrote:
In the turbine world, insurance premiums have skyrocketed.
That seems to take the heat from both airliners and low end GA?
Or something related to liability for wealthy passengers? and top corporate users?
Obviously, the case of Sala is something that GA is sensitive to, and I am sure both low & high end GA will pay for soon
Again? Mine almost doubled last year (although the coverage did get better).
BeechBaby wrote:
The Atlas 767 being the latest where the Captain had 25 hours on type, FO brand new. Ploughed it into a lake
There’s more to it than just flight hours: the FO was dangerously incompetent and had failed multiple checkrides.
BeechBaby wrote:
The Atlas 767 being the latest where the Captain had 25 hours on type, FO brand new. Ploughed it into a lake.
The only Atlas Air 767 accident I can find is this one, but it doesn’t fit your description. Do you have a reference?
