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Mandatory PBN training (merged)

JohnR wrote:

You have been doing this long enough to know the answer to your own question.

Not really. I can see why Skills Tests are as they are, but I think that revals should only reflect reality of what we do.

EGKB Biggin Hill

JohnR wrote:

For context the examiner I have used for a few years is an ex CAA chief examiner. The discussion was really about the difference between the technical requirement not to have to do a RAIM check, this does not exclude doing a NOTAM check, if using SBAS capable kit versus the practical issue,of being aware before departure that there may be an outage at the time of your approach. It was really about a scenario such as you had planned for an LPV approach and not checked RAIM availability. The only other approach is an NDB and you haven’t briefed for it or done an NDB approach for a while. Causes unnecessary stress so why not check for RAIM which would allow you to be prepared. I had short circuited the discussion by checking and printing the RAIM prediction for Glos at the time of our approach.

But your receiver can do a RAIM check. If you’re planning on using a GPS approach using a TSO-C129 receiver, sure, makes sense to check RAIM before flight. But if you have a TSO-C146 receiver and EGNOS turns out to be unavailable at the time of your approach, surely you just fly the LNAV. If RAIM is unavailable you’re having a bad day. Wait 10 minutes and RAIM will be available.

(It’s a good scenario to discuss)

Last Edited by bookworm at 29 Jul 17:50

Dual frequency GPS is going to change all this WAAS/EGNOS stuff. Well, you won’t need it. I am amazed nobody picked up that thread at the time.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

Timothy wrote:

Aviathor wrote:

To enlighten us, please cite what regulation requires that. Thanks

COMMISSION REGULATION (EU) 2016/539

Thanks.

My point exactly. This is Part-FCL. It does not apply to third-country license holders, including FAA airmen certificate holders.

LFPT, LFPN

From here

The problem with a 200+ page bible is that few will read it because their eyes will glaze over after about page 20, especially as at least 90% of it is not needed knowledge for any form of flying. It was originally written 10 years ago by Vasa Babic who had an amazing ability to read a 1000 page EASA doc and enjoy it; something almost nobody else can do. I did actually go through the whole lot and I was probably the first to look at that page.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

Peter wrote:

The problem with a 200+ page bible is that few will read it because their eyes will glaze over after about page 20, especially as at least 90% of it is not needed knowledge for any form of flying.

The next edition is going to be much shorter, and the very first page is going to be “how to fly an RNAV approach”, so we are tackling this issue

EGKB Biggin Hill

Aviathor wrote:

Timothy wrote:
I think that the point is that it’s not just approaches. If you are Part.FCL you need PBN privileges in the next four weeks to be able to fly airways.
To enlighten us, please cite what regulation requires that. Thanks

Then, when I answered with chapter and verse, Aviathor wrote:

My point exactly. This is Part-FCL. It does not apply to third-country license holders, including FAA airmen certificate holders.

…so I am completely confused as to what you want.

But the bottom line is:

If you have an EASA IR, you need PBN privileges if you want to fly airways after 25th August. After 25th August 2020, you will need them to be able to revalidate you IR, so no PBN = no IR.

If you have an FAA IR, you don’t yet need those privileges. However, if EU resident FAA IRs do need an EASA licence and IR in 2019, I believe that they will then need a PBN endorsement, but Bookworm is your man for that.

EGKB Biggin Hill

Timothy wrote:

If you have an FAA IR, you don’t yet need those privileges. However, if EU resident FAA IRs do need an EASA licence and IR in 2019, I believe that they will then need a PBN endorsement, but Bookworm is your man for that.

Put like that, I do agree. IF the April 8th 2019 deadline is not postponed yet again, EU residents who want to exercise IR privileges will indeed need the PBN endorsement starting April 8th 2019. As of today however, third country license holders do not need the PBN endorsement to exercise the privileges of their third-contry licenses, and we really don’t know what will happen next April 8th.

Last Edited by Aviathor at 30 Jul 08:35
LFPT, LFPN

That’s what I thought also, when asking here about FAA IR holders.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

Timothy wrote:

The next edition is going to be much shorter, and the very first page is going to be “how to fly an RNAV approach”, so we are tackling this issue

I hope the effort will be worth it, ie it will bring something new to the table in terms of presentation or otherwise. There are already plenty of documents around about how to fly RNAV approaches, including a very good guidance document from the CAA which one can argue is “only” 43 pages.

Although Vasa’s document is 200+ pages, it is not as hard to read as the number of pages may indicate, and it is very complete.

Last Edited by Aviathor at 30 Jul 08:44
LFPT, LFPN
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