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Hand Flying

I wondered for those who fly commercially, how much hand flying you are allowed to do, and I wondered if it was different between company operating procedures.

I ask because I attended a talk with John Hutchinson yesterday, former Concorde Captain, and he said most pilots would only engage the AP at about 28,000 ft when settled nicely into a supersonic climb. Others would engage the AP earlier, but take it off for the supersonic part, just for the experience. Some would fly the whole route without the AP at all. Though John apparently encouraged one such Captain, while doing a route checkout with him, that was no problem, but at least stick it on when tucking into the smoked salmon.

He also commented that Airbus designs are centred around the 'system', i.e. there was a focus on automation, and that for Boeing designs and systems were centred around the pilot.

I wondered what people's views on that were.

Hello!

Apart from RVSM airspace where handflying is generally not allowed I can hand fly as much as I want. For the sake of passenger comfort and safety we usually turn the autopilot on when passing FL100 in the climb (at latest) and off again at the minimum. On positioning flights without passengers we often hand-fly all the time to stay trained.

With Concorde it was a slightly different story because they were three in the cockpit and had flight attendents who looked after the passengers, so all the pilot flying had to do was flying with no other duties to perform.

EDDS - Stuttgart

At work I generally engage the autopilot on completion of flap retraction which is around 2000 foot at normal weights, on heavyweight takeoffs usually about 700 foot so I can monitor closely the flap retraction schedule which is very tight on my old lady (min. clean speed is 3 knots above flap limit...work that one out ...final flap retraction only wings level) On the approach autopilot out at around 2000ft unless I,m feeling very keen.Autopilot use is encouraged but hand flying not discouraged when appropriate ie. benign weather uncomplicated air traffic situation,both crew lightly work loaded and not tired.Flight data is very closely monitored most of us are keen to avoid phone calls from management ,my operation nowadays is always very conservative.In very bad weather approaches I,ll go manual early (except if autolanding of course) to get the feel of the day and the individual airframe.I still enjoy a handflown day visual approach into the Greek Islands if traffic is light...but the scourge of mass tourism has reached most places.My 120 hours a year of light aircraft flying and instructing is what keeps my poling sharp not sure how others cope? VBR Stampe

EGMD EGTO EGKR, United Kingdom

Not the usual sense of commercial flying- doing european charter/air ambulance ops in a MEP. Only tend to engage autopilot at top of climb and it normally comes off at top of descent. Not uncommon for it to be inop thus it's handflown. Management don't care whether hand flown or autopiot on at 1' agl and out for flare (not that we do that).

United Kingdom

I fly all serious flights on autopilot, and do hand flying when messing around in Class G, with the occasional ILS into a local airport for £20.

On any checkride, and hopefully I won't have to do another one ever apart from the annual JAA IR one, it pays to hand fly from well before the instrument approach even if autopilot is allowed, just to get the feel of it.

I still enjoy a handflown day visual approach into the Greek Islands if traffic is light

You envy your seriously hard life

The UK weather hasn't reached Greece yet
LGKC 131050Z 07007KT 030V110 9999 FEW006 26/18 Q1022

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

In summary, the impression is that in commercial air transport, there is still a lot of handflying in climb and descent, whereas in private IFR ops in small aircraft, pilots tend to activate the autopilot seconds after take-off and deactivate it at minimums. Maybe that due to two-crew vs. one-crew; maybe it's because many private IFR GA aircraft now have autopilots (DFC-90, GFC700) that are much superior to what is currently installed in most jet aircraft.

Mainz (EDFZ) & Egelsbach (EDFE), Germany

Maybe that due to two-crew vs. one-crew...

This is really the Big difference. When you hand fly in a multicrew operation, you do nothing else (most operators, including ours, do not even allow you to) but fly. Yoke, throttle and speed brakes, all other buttons knobs and levers are not to be touched. The pilot monitoring (in the old days called "pilot not flying" which is total nonsense because he is certainly not sitting stationary on the ground ;-) ) will do all this for him. And has a considerable workload, because he is supposed to monitor - even more than usual - what the handling pilot does, operate the radios, do the paperwork and look after the passengers (in our little aircraft with no flight attendents). My colleague just handflew me to Munich, therefore I know... (but no passengers to look after).

EDDS - Stuttgart

When you hand fly in a multicrew operation, you do nothing else (most operators, including ours, do not even allow you to) but fly. Yoke, throttle and speed brakes, all other buttons knobs and levers are not to be touched.

That I find really suprising. So the P2 is performing the "auto throttle" function as well?

Yet, in a sim on the LPC, you have to do everything yourself, even in a multi pilot aircraft - no?

maybe it's because many private IFR GA aircraft now have autopilots (DFC-90, GFC700) that are much superior to what is currently installed in most jet aircraft.

I think only a tiny % of the actually flying IFR community has these two autopilots, but most will have at least heading, NAV and altitude preselect & hold, which functionally do all that is required to really save most of the cockpit workload.

I also think there is a big variation in private GA as to how people use automatics - because there are no rules. Some people I know mostly hand fly, while others engage the AP after takeoff and disengage it at MDA.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

That I find really suprising. So the P2 is performing the "auto throttle" function as well?

No no no! "Yoke, throttle and speed brakes" I wrote. (The speed brake switch is very close to the throttles and only needed when idle dosen't slow you down quick enough i.e. to meet a speed requirement by ATC). But all other knobs like heading bug, course selector, altitude preselect, flight director mode, even autopilot engage are taboo while handflying. The aircraft manufacturers know that and place them centrally on the panel or in the center console so they can be operated by both pilots without reacing over to the other guys side.

EDDS - Stuttgart

... many private IFR GA aircraft now have autopilots (DFC-90, GFC700) that are much superior to what is currently installed in most jet aircraft.

Those two autopilots can do nothing that a 30 year old autopilot in a B737 or the 20 year old (by design, not by manufacture date) Honeywell installation in"my" Citation can't do. The buttons and controls are not so nicely grouped in one panel but spread over several panels according to a different logical reasoning but they are all there! Our autopilot is controlled from the autopilot panel, the flight director mode selector panel, the EFIS control panels, the course and heading selector panel, pitch and roll dials and the FMS. This is why several days of ground course are required for the avionics alone...

EDDS - Stuttgart
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