Menu Sign In Contact FAQ
Banner
Welcome to our forums

National CAA policies around Europe on busting pilots who bust controlled airspace (and danger areas)

My take on it is that the CAA knows they have no legal basis for prosecuting somebody in this case

Endangerment sounds plausible. The clue this time is in the similarity of the names

EGKB Biggin Hill

I believe it was Endangerment used as the argument for the Ullswater water skiing CAA prosecution which was thrown straight out by the magistrate I believe.

Endangerment sounds plausible.

Don’t they need to prove that there was actual danger?

The vast majority of DAs everywhere are bits of air with no activity in them most of the time. They are mostly owned by the military who routinely declare them active because if they don’t they might eventually lose them. For example yesterday the UK D036+ complex had only some helicopters in it, operating below 3000ft. That seems a completely silly way to reserve such a vast piece of airspace.

With a speed limit, there is no danger to be proven because the law says that exceeding it is a crime.

I believe it was Endangerment used as the argument for the Ullswater water skiing CAA prosecution which was thrown straight out by the magistrate I believe.

Yes; the cheque from the CAA for the costs was posted here, though I can’t find it right now

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

Can anyone think of another provision under which entry into a DA might be prosecutable?

If it is not illegal, I wonder if there is still a case for re-education? I mean, it really isn’t big or clever to wander into danger areas, most of them are there for a reason, you can’t rely on the military not being about to use them. Honest question.

EGKB Biggin Hill

I wonder if there is still a case for re-education?

Depends how many manage to disrupt, or at worst perish due to an “infringement”, I suppose?

The thought of being blown apart or having equipment failure caused by military weapons under testing or other experimentation is enough for me to stay well clear unless I’m in touch with the relevant information or crossing service…..

Last Edited by James_Chan at 20 Aug 14:51

Timothy wrote:

Can anyone think of another provision under which entry into a DA might be prosecutable?

Byelaws made under the Military Lands Act 1892 according to the UK CAA infringements site (link).

London, United Kingdom

Byelaws made under the Military Lands Act 1892

Is recourse criminal or civil?

And anyway they only apply to some DAs not all. What about the others?

Last Edited by Timothy at 20 Aug 16:33
EGKB Biggin Hill

I often wonder about this. I’m in the habit of checking every piece of DA, MOA or Restricted (and similar airspace) with ATC, FIS or Flight Service (Basic service, anyone?) regardless of notams etc. before entering. Sometimes the response is crystal clear – “You are clear to cross” but sometimes not so clear. Once, in Nevada, I thought I’d try my luck with the restricted around Groome Lake (aka Area 51). I thought I heard “Cleared for the transition” and read it back. “No, no”, came the urgent reply, “You have to go around”.

But in UK the responses are sometimes ambiguous: “It’s cold” – does that just mean it’s not active, or am I ‘clear to cross’ as Langen information would say? Once in that situation I got buzzed by Hawks, and to this day don’t know if that was because I was an infringer, or just because they were having a good time. The whole system seems so vague and now in this era of 100% reporting (of mode S traffic like me) positively risky. Maybe now I’ll ask for clarification: “request confirm clear to cross”, just to make sure it’s on the tape (if there is one). I bet Valley will love that.

EGBW / KPRC, United Kingdom

But, of course, if it’s Class G and there is no legal restriction, there can be no clearance. Like MATZ.

EGKB Biggin Hill

Criminal according to para 3 in Ministry of Defence: Byelaws Review (link). Others are likely covered by byelaws made under other statutes. There’s a long list on Wikipedia (link).

London, United Kingdom
Sign in to add your message

Back to Top