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Climate change

Nice graphs, and I have no question you have a bright future ahead of you as a climatologist, but forgive me if I take this Wiki para:

Since at least the start of the 20th century, the average global sea level has been rising. More precise data gathered from satellite radar measurements reveal an accelerating rise. This acceleration is due mostly to human-caused global warming, which is driving thermal expansion of seawater and the melting of land-based ice sheets and glaciers. Climate scientists expect the rate to further accelerate during the 21st century.

over your hypothesis on this occasion.

I know, I know. I’m just another naive fool, controlled and deluded by a big European government, because that’s just what they want me to believe etc etc.

But keep persevering. The truth is out there

Last Edited by DavidJ at 13 May 22:03

DavidJ wrote:

Climate scientists expect the rate to further accelerate during the 21st century.

We’ll see, the ‘expectation’ seems to be based more on hope than data. So far (over the last 120 years or so) there’s been very little change in rate (slope of the curves) when considering the exponential increase in human energy consumption during the same period.

The truth is indeed out there, and I doubt it’s a doomsday scenario when considering all the factors in parallel play over the next 100 – 1000 years. Given that nothing you or I do will make much difference to the developing worlds accelerating use of fossil fuel energy, that will be a good thing.

Perhaps (best case) people will get smart and stop reproducing at a ridiculous rate, making a miserable, overpopulated world for their offspring in doing so.

Last Edited by Silvaire at 13 May 22:26
Evidence for global warming passes physics gold-standard. Global warming due to mainly human cause is considered a fact according to scientists.
Last Edited by AeroPlus at 14 May 20:11
EDLE, Netherlands

AeroPlus wrote:

Global warming due to mainly human cause is considered a fact according to scientists.

Looks more like numerology to me (in all seriousness). The climate is a dynamic physical and very real system, not a statistical, theoretical analysis of numbers centered around a steady state value. It’s a multitude of cycles with different time scales and everything is changing as time marches along. Old cycles dies, new cycles are born, seemingly out of nowhere. Perfect for politicians, since nothing you say is really wrong. Perfect for religious minded, since anything can happen and no one can predict it. Impossible for scientific analysis, since the cause and effect are intertwined, and true randomness can cause huge changes, even catastrophic events.

The true understanding of the climate is today about as advanced as when everyone believed the earth was flat, and if you disagree, you are an heretic.

We can do nothing but adapt to changing climate. It’s all the other things we should focus on. Land use, way too many people, plastic and other pollution. These are things we understand to a much higher degree, they can be measured and fixed.

Last Edited by LeSving at 15 May 17:11
The elephant is the circulation
ENVA ENOP ENMO, Norway

There is a really excellent book by Christopher Booker ’ The real climate disaster’ that will open your eyes to the scam that is going on. Did you know that the temperature on Triton and Pluto is also rising, probably not antropogenic if you ask me.
The hockey stick would emerge from the computer model even if fed with random data.

if you want to see and understand ‘the other side’ this is a good place to start.

EBKT

DavidJ wrote:

I know, I know. I’m just another naive fool, controlled and deluded by a big European government, because that’s just what they want me to believe etc etc.

Not really. What used to surprise me (not anymore though) is that all these data are freely available for everybody too look at and discuss, tons and tons of data, yet no one seems to look at it. People would much rather “hear it from someone” than to see it with their own eyes. This isn’t the behavior of a naive fool, this is a very different behavior. The naive fool would look at the data, and perhaps (very likely) ignore comments from others. He would perhaps make weird conclusions, but at least it would be conclusions based on data, not on some belief system of others. A more scientific approach is to look at the data, then discuss it openly without prejudice.

To give you the benefit of the doubt. Look at the data Silvaire has presented above. Don’t you think it is a little odd that the coldest period was around 1910, while at that time the sea level had since long been rising ? why/why not ? Why, with the data at hand (and there are tons of more), would you rather quote and believe in some PC wikipage that obviously is ignoring what is actually measured?

The elephant is the circulation
ENVA ENOP ENMO, Norway

I’m an engineer. I understand trucks, cooling systems and heat-exchangers. Ask me anything you want about those.
When I have health questions, I go ask a doctor. When my AME told me to get my heart checked, I got my heart checked. You can feed me all the data you want about hearts, I am not nearly qualified enough to make any sort of judgment. After his exam the heart doctor told me I was good to go, I believe him.
When I have climate questions, I will ask climatologists. They tell me we’re ruining the atmosphere.

ESMK, Sweden

Arne, that is very true about relying on your Doctor but just imagine if your doctor’s source of income was not from you, but only from the Drug companies. Would you trust him so much then?

In the UK there have been lots of issues in the past where GP’s (who are being paid £ 120,000 per annum), have received free weekends away as they have prescribed target levels of Statins or other drugs. So in spite of the vast bulk of their income being provided by the NHS, some doctors have been prescribing statins to virtually every patient over 50 years of age just to get some small incentive.

I don’t see enough debate or skepticism in the field of climate change. What worries me is that the Scientists who seem to come up with questions are not dealt with by open debate but are treated as dangerous subversives and shut down. It is good to see the debate in this forum as it is something you would never see on the BBC for example.

United Kingdom

After his exam the heart doctor told me I was good to go, I believe him.

That doesn’t actually work, in most parts of the world There is no such thing as a simple “good to go”. There are degrees… But that’s another debate

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

Silvaire wrote:

I also note that the clear trend in wealthier countries is that people are moving to areas where it is warmer

I thought we’d hit rock bottom with that statement about the miserable conditions predicted from a 4c global increase.

But it would appear that we still had some way to go…

dirkdj wrote:

Did you know that the temperature on Triton and Pluto is also rising?

I feel sorry for Pluto, but at least it’s now on the list of places people might move to.

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