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Corona / Covid-19 Virus - General Discussion (politics go to the Off Topic / Politics thread)

Emir wrote:

It’s not easy to explain how here in Croatia at the same time we had selfishness of such kind and extreme solidarity and help for victims of devastating earthquake.

Part of the explanation is something like “symbolic action bias”: People want to actively do something where they can almost immediately see an effect. I’d rather help a frog over the street to be able to tell everyone “see, here’s the frog I saved” that abstractly saving 1000 lives. This is why it is much easier to find people to clean up the local pond rather than to do something useful against climate change. Or why (at least pre Corona) myriads of young Europeans went “helping” in orphanages in Africa, Asia or Latam instead of actually helping them much more by spending the very same time behind the counter of a local junk food outlet and donating the money they earned there to such charity…

Germany

Malibuflyer wrote:

Unfortunately this pandemic has clearly shown that most people are extremely selfish and if there is no immediate benefit for themselves and not realistic punishment they fear, they are happy to kill other people even if what is ask from them is as little as wearing a mask.

The old saying goes “Your right to swing your fist ends at my nose”.

Those who refuse to take measures to protect others [e.g., refuse vaccination or refuse to wear masks in public transport] will, quite rightfully, be increasingly excluded from places where these others are.

Biggin Hill

Just to give a real impression of how infectious this is: the single case we had from a Steam Packet (ferry) worker has been directly traced to 21 new cases here in just one week.

Andreas IOM

Cobalt wrote:

The old saying goes “Your right to swing your fist ends at my nose”.

Those who refuse to take measures to protect others [e.g., refuse vaccination or refuse to wear masks in public transport] will, quite rightfully, be increasingly excluded from places where these others are.

If you want to use that old saying then the real question is whether a person’s individual healthcare / attire choices constitutes them ‘swinging their fist’.

Many would argue, with no small amount of logic, that it does not.

We do not place restrictions on HIV+ individuals to protect others, such as making it illegal for them to have unprotected sex, or to have sex without first disclosing their status. We provide education on the risks that are out there in the world and expect the uninfected to manage their own risk. The virus and the mode of transmission may be different, but the principle of who is responsible for your health (you are) holds, I believe.

EGLM & EGTN

We do not place restrictions on HIV+ individuals to protect others, such as making it illegal for them to have unprotected sex, or to have sex without first disclosing their status

Such cases have come to the courts though, under, IIRC GBH. Not sure how far any of them got.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

Graham wrote:

We do not place restrictions on HIV+ individuals to protect others, such as making it illegal for them to have unprotected sex, or to have sex without first disclosing their status.

Interesting point because there seems to be big difference between countries: In Germany it clearly constitutes criminal assault if a HIV positive (who knows about it) has unprotected sex with another individual w/o disclosing their status. Tons of court rulings about that.

Graham wrote:

The virus and the mode of transmission may be different, but the principle of who is responsible for your health (you are) holds, I believe.

The question in my opinion is: What does it take to protect yourself? And therefore the mode of transmission is not irrelevant.

For HIV (as ppt for all other diseases that are only transmissible by exchange of body fluid) all it takes to protect myself is to not touch other peoples blood and not have unprotected sex with people I don’t know. Even thought the law is different in Germany, I could follow a line of reasoning that says that potential recipients can protect themselfes
For Covid (as ppt for all other diseases that are transmitted via airborne infection) I think the situation is different: The only way to protect myself would be to stay in my cellar.

Germany

Graham wrote:

We do not place restrictions on HIV+ individuals to protect others, such as making it illegal for them to have unprotected sex, or to have sex without first disclosing their status.

The UK really doesn’t? In Sweden HIV+ individuals have to disclose their status to anyone they risk infecting. Unprotected sex by HIV+ individuals without disclosure has been considered legally equivalent to causing (attempting to cause) grievous bodily harm – which is certainly illegal. Of course today most HIV+ individuals on modern anti-HIV medication don’t risk infecting anyone even by unprotected sex.

ESKC (Uppsala/Sundbro), Sweden

Sorry, perhaps I wasn’t clear about HIV. There have been prosecutions in the UK too, but it is basically under existing criminal law – GBH or some such, and of course to have sex with someone is much more definitive act that it is possible to make someone responsible for compared to simply exhaling in a public place (which would appear to be the suggested ‘fist-swinging’ with respect to Covid-19). What I meant about HIV was that we don’t generally put extra measures in place, we don’t metaphorically make them paint a red cross on their door.

Malibuflyer wrote:

For Covid (as ppt for all other diseases that are transmitted via airborne infection) I think the situation is different: The only way to protect myself would be to stay in my cellar.

Then it comes down to how much we’re prepared to tolerate risk from natural phenomena and to what extent we view it as the role of government to eliminate these risks. We tolerate and manage many different risks in our daily lives – as aviators we probably understand this more than most.

EGLM & EGTN

Dear Mr
You have been invited to book your COVID-19 vaccinations. Prompt booking via the link is advised as there are only a few appointments available at present.
Please click on the link…

Booked for 1 week from now.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

Peter wrote:

You have been invited to book your COVID-19 vaccinations

So this is it then, the end of EuroGA

The elephant is the circulation
ENVA ENOP ENMO, Norway
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