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Germany and Italy not recognising the Danish zero-VAT import route, or Italy not recognising certificate of EU VAT paid

Peter wrote:

So you need some form of proof that the plane has always been in the EU.

This is always mind boggling since you don’t have to keep records forever. Who carries the burden of proof? How long can they wait before they remember you owe them tax?

And that brings us to the journey log.

Not even a journey log. ICAO suggests 6 months. Someone told me Canada wants 3 years. USA want I think 3 months. EASA 6 months for commercial ops. Aircraft’s logbooks should be complete since they are valuable (but not all aircraft have such a well documented history). However, I wouldn’t consider them much of a proof.

the Channel Islands

I remember Channel Islands being mentioned in that Directive as one of the places where it doesn’t apply. There were a few others (e.g. Canary Islands).

How does it work with importing something that used to be in the EU?

Last Edited by Martin at 09 Apr 10:56

This is always mind boggling since you don’t have to keep records forever.

I agree. No idea how this is resolved.

Speaking of the UK, for tax purposes, you generally have 6 years (commencing from the end of the relevant tax year) to keep records for. That protects you from an honest mistake, by you or by the tax man. After that, they cannot go after you for undeclared tax. BUT if they find fraud during an investigation done within those 6 years, they can go further back, as far as they like. One predecent I read about was 25 years but that was just in the media so probably not useful…

Whether this applies to aircraft VAT I don’t know but I don’t see why not. The Danish 0 VAT route closed at the end of 2009, or was it 2010? So very soon nobody in the UK will need to worry about the UK taxman worrying about it. It was a tax avoidance (legal) process, not a tax evasion (illegal) process.

There are much tighter time guidelines for opening enquiries into company accounts (the accountants here will know, of course) but in practice HMRC use the old police tactic “Sir, you were not driving straight” to stop you for a breath check They can always find some mistake and then they use that to open an “enquiry”. Been there, done that.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

Peter, about 5 years ago an acquaintance was being investigated for tax avoidance (in UK) and during the investigation he was asked if he enjoyed his holiday in NY 25 years earlier.

He said that he did to which they replied ’didn’t you and your wife have both report your Rolex watches stolen and made an insurance claim for the value of them ?’

Followed by ‘where did you get the money from to but the watches ?’

The assumed tax avoided plus penalty plus interest was added to the total bill.

* He never had the watches in the first place, which shows that even in the long run crime doesn’t pay!

That’s really funny, but I find that story very hard to believe, simply as stated and with no other factors pointing to the era 25 years before.

I reckon there was some factor back then which linked to present time e.g. some presently owned asset was claimed to have been bought with proceeds of some transaction 25 years before.

Otherwise, when asked about something 25 years ago, you could just go

and tell them to stick it somewhere warm and dark

That said, UK tax people have a right to assess you having had some income (which they don’t have to have evidence of), tax you on it, and it is up to you to prove they are wrong. It’s called, I think, a “lifestyle assessment”. I know a few people who got the benefit of it… one was found to have a 20k ski boat, another a Ferrari, and both were low-level builders. I think most “advanced” countries have a similar system, otherwise you could just openly flaunt assets bought with non-laundered funds. It would put money laundering out of business overnight.

Back on VAT and planes, the UK did the 1980s amnesty but I don’t know if that happened anywhere else.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

So much for the free movement of goods & services within the EU, if the small guy uses the tax system for his advantage then he gets a visit from the police, airlines register their aircraft in Eire to avoid all sorts of taxes and employment obligations and no one troubles big business.

Another reason I’m voting to free the UK from the Brussels mafia.

A_and_C wrote:

Another reason I’m voting to free the UK from the Brussels mafia.

The Pound is now down 10% from last year’s average, relative to the Euro.

Last Edited by Airborne_Again at 10 Apr 08:21
ESKC (Uppsala/Sundbro), Sweden

A_and_C wrote:

no one troubles big business.

They try. But big boys always could pay for smart lawyers. And the issue here really isn’t “Brussels mafia”. In the end, EU could actually protect you from something like this. Question is, who would be willing to spend years in courts.

The issue with big business is probably more political.

Imagine a large multi national, who one the one hand you’re (as a government) trying to encourage to choose your country to expand operations in (to become a bigger employer) and on the other hand you’re getting extremely aggressive over the tax policy.

It’s very easy for big business to decide that they are going elsewhere and all those jobs are lost to another country. One small press release citing “challenges with dealing with county x’s administration” would do terrible damage to a government’s popularity. Of course big business is rarely involved in pure tax evasion, but their tax planning might be a bit more aggressive.

EIWT Weston, Ireland

Martin wrote:

Martin 08-Apr-16 10:58 #46
C210_Flyer wrote:
How many start up companies die before they even break even? A lot. Throw in aviation and its even more. Anyone ever hear of the expression, "How do you make a million $ in aviation? Answer Start with 2 million dollars.
What that has to do with it? It’s no coincidence that I didn’t use the word profit. I’m talking about companies that don’t render any services, don’t manufacture anything, don’t add anything, it was never intended, they exist just as funnels for money. Authorities don’t like this. Well, I imagine they don’t like any structure that lowers taxes but there is a limit to what they can successfully attack.

Bluebeard wrote:

I was referring to Peters Quote of Producing Value. Please define Value.

KHTO, LHTL

I wouldn’t come to Italy with an N-Reg. This seems the final decision of the Highest Court in Italy: https://www.milanotoday.it/cronaca/sequestro-aerei-finanza-asti.html

Probably you’ll get away if you are non-Italian or, better, non-European, but you’ll get checked anyway

United Kingdom
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