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Winter operations / lowest temperature for starting / preheating methods (merged)

I bought a Reiff preheat directly with them. Payed by CC IIRC. They were easy to work with. I had to deal with my local customs office but it worked out OK.

Spruce sells the Reiff systems as well, so you could order it with one of the European re-sellers if you want.

EDFM (Mannheim), Germany

I wonder re the viability of the mains power powered engine warmers (e.g. Tanis) but battery powered.

Frankly, European airport politics prevent a mains power connection except to a select band of very lucky pilots, but if a one-shot battery pack contained enough energy… I see a Tanis draws 460W, and how long would a LIPO battery, say 20×10×5cm, last on that? You would need an inverter to 110V, although with enough cells in series, maybe not.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

I am advised that it would be much safer to use a number of 18650 cells. They are better quality than model plane batteries and much less likely to catch fire. For example Tesla use them. One would need about 30 in series to get 110V DC.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

@peter Not small, light, or cheap. But something like this should in theory power a tanis for about 2-3 hours (depending on the actual real world deliverable capacity of the battery. Stated numbers are always a bit… interesting). Im sure there are other similar solutions out there at varying capacities, prices, and quality.

https://www.solarpowersupply.de/ecoflow-delta-1300-portable-battery-generator

Rumor has it that a Eberspacher S2 camper heating kit works very well, all you need is a battery providing 30Wh (no big deal) and 0.3l of diesel / Jet A1 per hour (DuBro RC fuel tanks work very well).

Less heavy than a generator and easier to haul around when installed neatly in a general purpose plastic toolbox. Added advantage, you don’t need to wait four hours for the warm-up.

T28
Switzerland

Yes that would be enough. After all, one doesn’t need to heat up the 200kg lump to +20C

A simple and “completely safe” solution would be a lead-acid battery. Trivial to charge anywhere. But they hold much less energy. And an inverter to whatever the heater voltage is – if you have to have an inverter it doesn’t matter whether it is 110 or 230, and 230 is more useful in Europe in case you can get mains power to the aircraft.

That Eberspacher S2 camper heating kit looks interesting. Could it burn avgas? Reminds me of this thread. One would have to empty it out before flying with it, I reckon. The other problem is that one has to be extremely careful with anything with a “fire” inside it, near a plane. I also reckon the fire crew would be really nervous.

This does illustrate rather well how much more energy you have in a liquid fuel than in a battery

I bought that Primus stove because it can burn avgas, not realising that using avgas for cooking utensils is not a great idea But it does work – once you manage to light it.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

Aircraft parked outside. Aeroshell 15W50. Once its cold and regardless of how cold I just jump in pump a few primes, turn the master on and fire up. 1200 rpm is set and I don’t do anything till the oil temp gauge moves. I then fly the aircraft for a minimum of 20 minutes.

Last 6 engines never made TBO. Well apart from my Rotax which has done double its TBO and gets operated in the same way. Just swap prime for choke and 15W50 for cheaper supermarket 10/40.

The S2 doesn’t burn gas (of any kind) but the B4 burns unleaded. Not quite sure how the innards of it would react to LL which is why I got the S2.

The upgrade will be hooking two of them to the controller and heating the inside at the same time. Probably overkill, but fun.

An inverter is not needed since they are 12v.

T28
Switzerland

Bathman wrote:

Last 6 engines never made TBO

Because I’m afraid you were using bad starting/warm up technique.
1200RPM on cold day/not warmed engine is way too much. You should set it to max 800-900 for first 2-3 minutes. As low as the engine is able to work without vibrations.
And never allow the engine to “roar” above that value during startup.
Acc to some experienced engineers – 80% of engine wear happens during starting/warming up.
Rotax for sure will be much more resistant to high rpm/improper starting technique as its pistons/cylinders are much smaller and therefore clearance changes are much lower comparing to “classical” Lyco/Conti engines during warmup.

Poland

Gentlemen,
I wrote about it some time ago. I made a humidity tests inside my engines before/during/after preheating.
Don’t do your preheating for more than 2-3 hours. Humidity level rises violently during this process. Sound not logical but it’s the fact.
The mechanism of this is that the oil in the sump contains quite a lot of trapped moisture which was produced during combustion process.
During winter time it’s quite regular that your oil temp. will not be enough to make that moisture evaporate completely (that is my case even in the summer).
During preheating process the oil warms up and the moisture is being released to the engine block. Not a problem for 2-3 hours but definitely bad if lasts for 12 hours or more.
There is somewhere a warning in operating manual of Conti or Lyco engine that preheating for more than 24 hours may cause severe corrosion attack – so this is confirmed even by factory.

Poland
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