Don’t forget that at 45° bank, the stall speed increases by x1.19. So I wouldn’t suggest a speed of 1.3*Vso for a steep turn. Just don’t bank that much. In slow flight I wouldn’t do more than maybe 25° bank. Airspeed (respectively ground speed) is much more relevant to reduce the turn radius.
The exact procedure aside: Most importantly, never ever climb towards a mountain pass and think ahead about the altitude you need before entering a valley. In the alps I never enter a valley without having the altitude of the pass +1000ft. Then, if anything goes wrong, e.g. if you entered the wrong valley, recognize early that you might not make it and turn away (thus, fly left or right but not in the middle of the valley).
Airborne_Again wrote:
As airspeed decreased below Vx, approach flap, approach airspeed (1,3*Vso) and a 45° banking U-turn. (Into wind, if possible.)
and PITCH DOWN to maintain speed even if that means clipping treetops.
If you can’t make it, you never could anyway, if you make it you will have marginally cheated someone.
petakas wrote:
PITCH DOWN to maintain speed even if that means clipping treetops.
If you can’t make it, you never could anyway, if you make it you will have marginally cheated someone.
Like in this case that happened right next to my village: http://elao.gr/web/documents/04_2011_Report_GR.pdf
All 3 survived.
petakas wrote:
The CFI was expert in aerobatics,
If that’s the case, couldn’t he have flown a chandelle to get out? Serious question, I am no aerobatic guy, but have flown chandelles with an instructor and found it quite amazing in how little space you can turn the a/c around. That said, a C172 may not have to power for it.
172driver wrote:
That said, a C172 may not have to power for it.
C172s are approved for chandelles, but according to the POH the entry speed is 105 knots and they were flying at 90 knots or less in the canyon.
petakas wrote:
and PITCH DOWN to maintain speed even if that means clipping treetops.
I asked someone who survived an EFATO in a Cub, he told me for some reason he flew it in trees to cushion the impact instead of maneuvering around houses to get back to tarmac and he walked away from it on the day, his only regret was delaying that decision as he had better tree choices earlier when it happened…
For a chandelle you must not be anywhere near the back of the curve, because you have to do a 30 deg UP and a 30 deg roll, at the same time, and keep that going until you have turned through 180 degrees. In the TB20 (I did them in the FAA CPL) I was initiating the maneuver at the cruise speed of 140kt and one is doing a “lot” less than 140 by the time one is done.
Very steep descending turn, after steep climb losing speed, and taking advantage of any side gully.
172driver wrote:
If that’s the case, couldn’t he have flown a chandelle to get out?
The report in Greek says that in the video during the left final turn (0 VSI – 50Kts IAS and overly banking left) the instructor’s left leg can be seen constantly fully pressing left rudder … that may be a clue of a last effort of a chandelle as a last resort…
petakas wrote:
The report in Greek says that in the video during the left final turn (0 VSI – 50Kts IAS and overly banking left) the instructor’s left leg can be seen constantly fully pressing left rudder … that may be a clue of a last effort of a chandelle as a last resort
Yeah, but at 50kts they were way too slow. Sad, anyway. I flew the chandelles with an instructor in a C172RG and we entered at full cruise speed. Just wondering if an experienced acro flyer (not me!!) could pull it off at 90kts, which apparently was the speed they had going into that valley.
