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Danger areas in the Channel, and Eurocontrol routings through them

It is, Tobias.

But the hints are very faint and well hidden. It’s a tiny paragraph in ENR1.1, which then points to ENR 5.1.

Mainz (EDFZ) & Egelsbach (EDFE), Germany

tschnell wrote:

Is this really required (talking about a VFR flight)? How would I as a foreign pilot know if this is not even mentioned in the AIP?

Indeed….I got caught out badly at Tain Range a long time ago when I first started flying in the UK…I called them after I was already halfway through and got a bollocking….it was news to me that I needed permission to fly through a Danger area…they should be called Restricted areas IMO.

YPJT, United Arab Emirates

It’s printed in the AIP and quite clear in SkyDemon, why would people not know?

I am not sure if UK ATC have access to the UK AIP, or indeed if they can display PDFs on their screens. I doubt it; they can read EuroGA only during their breaks

Most ATC software runs on some flavour of unix AFAIK. That was why the AFPEX thingy was written in java, so it runs “everywhere” within the various ATC systems. I don’t think there is a unix version of SD (maybe you could suggest that to Tim, (very carefully)?) but I believe there are various Windows emulators for it so ATC could run it…? It would truly be a PR scoop for SD to become the definitive reference on UK airspace for UK ATC!

.it was news to me that I needed permission to fly through a Danger area

Some you can, some you can’t, and since finding out which ones is a pig of a job, most people just fly around them. I am not aware of a single “book” like the one which comes with the 1:1M French SIA chart package. Most of the time it is immaterial, but not always; avoiding the one in my post #6 takes you way out over the sea for no good reason, but most of the time it is active when I ask Southend.

Back to my original point: can anyone confirm whether the “MON-FRI” thing is a new one for 2018?

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

No it is not – the text pages of the Jeppesen VFR Manual – UK 2-2-15 dated 28 Jul 17 state clearly “Mon-Fri 0800-1800LT & by NOTAM”

EHLE / Lelystad, Netherlands, Netherlands

It has been Weekdays only for quite a number of years. I can’t remember when it was not.

EGKB Biggin Hill

Interesting that London Control have been unaware, as have the French, and been diligently routing everybody around it as if it was active, always, weekdays, weekends…

You would think that if the AIP stated MON-FRI explicitly then everybody in the business would know that. No need to coordinate with Plymouth Mil, which they obviously aren’t going to do when doing tactical traffic management.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

Plymouth Mil is not always there when they are closed. It depends on whether the other ranges are in use.

Why not raise this with NATS, or ask the PPL/IR Infrastrucure Working Group lead, Ed Bellamy, to bring it up at NATMAC?

EGKB Biggin Hill

You never fail to squeeze in your PPL/IR advert, Timothy but with no answer to what I asked about why ATC never (IME) route traffic through there. The basic point is that they don’t need Plymouth Mil to tell them they are inactive at weekends!

The other separate issue is that (presumably) the UK is not telling IFPS about the weekend inactivity.

NATS and the CAA already read EuroGA

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

Peter wrote:

Since I got the IR in 2006 London Control have never let me go through them.

Haven’t you yet worked out, after 12 years, that London Control has it in for you, Peter?

That is an even less good advert for PPL/IR, bookworm

I have always had excellent service from them.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom
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