In the May 2016 issue of the GA Buyer magazine presenting the TBM 900 series I read this:
The TBM 900 and TBM 930 can perform short-haul flights (such as a round-trip Paris-Cannes trip) with a three-hour flight time that is similar to commercial airline routing, and a cost of approximately €3,000 in carrying six persons.
If my math is correct that makes €1,000 per hour. I’ve been calculating the cost of the Cessna T303 Crusader I’ve discussed on a different thread and I come up to about 1050 Swiss francs per hour including everything (also airway taxes, landing fees, etc.) except the initial cost of the aircraft. That’s a difference in cost between the two aircraft of less than 10%, so I am thinking: how realistic is this €1,000 per hour for the TBM and what does it include? Does it include everything? Does it include even the initial cost (interest on leasing)? Does it lack some of the costs?
It all depends on their annual flight time. For a high usage it is definitely not unreasonable.
I would say that including each and every penny into the hourly cost is a good way of taking the fun out of it.
There is a cost of owning it without flying, and then there is the actual flight time. Many private aircraft never reach their hourly TBO before calendar is due so there is no point in trying to calculate it in to the hourly cost.
Sounds like direct operating costs, excluding capital/depreciation but also probably excluding handling (Cannes not being cheap).
Fly310 wrote:
It all depends on their annual flight time.
Sure. I used 3 pilots x 30 hours per year for the T303. I suppose the TBM calculation is based on several hours per day.
RobertL18C wrote:
probably excluding handling (Cannes not being cheap)
I didn’t include handling in my cost calculations either as they vary too much.
In the US, it seems like the Meridians are about $600/hr planes. The TBM’s and PC12’s are around $800-1000/hr planes.
I don’t know any useful detail in this case, but to get real data you need to speak to a real owner who gets really involved in operations and maintenance.
The DOC (direct operating cost) is the cost of flying exactly one more hour. So if you are on say a 5hr flight and you get headwind and it takes 6hrs, the DOC is the exact cost of that one extra hour. No more.
I would be amazed if a TBM was anywhere near €1000/hr.
Maybe someone intimately familiar can throw some figures in?
It’s going to be
From previous posts here, it might appear that nobody in Europe runs a TBM on Part 91 and instead writes a blank cheque to a dealer to do the whole Socata MM.
Do US owners do the same?
On the anything else you have airways charges, oxygen (pressurised, but the oxygen needs maintenance), data charges/EFB, tyres, accounting, etc. Unless the aircraft is flying 500-600 hours p.a. , in Europe €2,000 all in may be more realistic for a newish aircraft (three years old).
A lot of operators fly max cruise but temperature limit to 750o TIT, hence coming in 10 or 20 knots below marketing brochure speeds. May be psychological and does produce some fuel savings, presumably kinder on the engine (one).
My guess is that the depreciation (or alternatively the lease cost if leased) is probably going to be the largest owner cost (when measured by the hour), albeit that it doesn’t actually vary by the hour: one extra hour’s flight doesn’t affect the value of the hull itself, but the annual depreciation in £$ divided by the average number hours flown by owners in a year would be an interesting number. What I’d like to know, for something like a TBM900 is what happens to the average hull value in the first three years of ownership. Does anyone have a handle on this?
Another interesting question : do owners and potential owners worry about potentially buying into a plane type that subsequently sells poorly? One doesn’t want to end up owning a plane that captures so little of a market that the model is quickly dropped by the manufacturer or so that second owners are hard to find and parts too later on. I imagine this is a very significant ownership risk for new models.
Perhaps TBM owners are generally wealthy enough not to worry too much about things like depreciation, but this thread is about ownership cost and I’m an accountant in my spare time :D
The real test for advertised hourly charges is if the salesman is willing to rent out his demo aircraft at that rate. The local Eclipse 550 dealer at our airport has got a big advert saying the plane costs 800 Euro per hour. When I asked if they would rent out for that price they said they only want to sell airplanes…
Vladimir wrote:
how realistic is this €1,000 per hour for the TBM and what does it include? Does it include everything? Does it include even the initial cost (interest on leasing)? Does it lack some of the costs?
Suppose you buy one today at $4,1M and sell five years later for $2,5M with 1000h (5 y.o. 850s are in that price range today). That’s $1600/h already. Service is free during that period, so only need to add hangar insurance and fuel. I’d say 2000EUR/h is realistic.
