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How far can you get in Europe without Mode S, and can ATC see the Mode S data?

Sure…

Mainz (EDFZ) & Egelsbach (EDFE), Germany

With a twin, I would definitely do the route Aberdeen – Stavanger for the fun of it.

I did it (out and back again) with a TB20 once. I wore a survival suit, of course.

ESKC (Uppsala/Sundbro), Sweden

It would be IFR for pretty much all of it. So other countries have mode S req’s for IFR as well?

None of Denmark, Finland, Iceland, Norway or Sweden require mode S in any airspace.

ESKC (Uppsala/Sundbro), Sweden

Sorry Jan but as you are normally such a stickler for accuracy – the country is The Netherlands. North and South Holland are just two provinces.

Last Edited by Peter_Mundy at 31 May 17:45
EHLE / Lelystad, Netherlands, Netherlands

Fair enough, Peter – there was some tongue in cheek intention behind that…
You have it absolutely fully correct.

EBZH Kiewit, Belgium

IIRC since 2012 the UK has required Mode-S in transponder mandatory zones (there aren’t many of these…yet).

Andreas IOM

I have the same problem at my local club in southern Sweden – Mode C on most aircraft as there has not been any real need to upgrade yet. Flights are mainly in the local area and some small % extends to Denmark where Mode C doesn’t seem to be a problem either.

Was in Germany last week and cancelled IFR before reaching the german border to continue VFR. I know that there are restrictions to VFR without Mode S (e.g. 5000 ft, no class C and D etc.) as this thread mentions. Does anyone know if those restrictions also apply for IFR – or Mode S is mandatory for all IFR flights in Germany?

ESMH

Yes.

Mainz (EDFZ) & Egelsbach (EDFE), Germany

You can ask German ATC for an exemption which they would typically grant. I have flown IFR without transponder in Germany with permission from ATC (obtained prior to IFR pickup, not before). Without transponder is a bit tedious because they need to ask you to confirm your altitude every few minutes but Mode C has no inconvenience associated. Very often I hear on the radio “XXXX, please enable Mode C on your transponder, only get Mode A signal”. I never heard “do not get Mode S”.

Imagine you cancel an IFR flight and do VFR down low in dubious weather and put yourself in danger. How stupid would that be?

Thanks for the info!

achimha wrote:

obtained prior to IFR pickup, not before

You mean on the radio? What if negative reply and IFR is needed due to weather, go back and land I guess.

Similar, when you fly IFR from e.g. Sweden or Denmark and entering German airspace. Perhaps you will never get cleared further if no prior exemption has been granted. It may not even be possible to file an IFR flight plan within German airspace without Mode S anyway. Haven’t tried yet.

ESMH
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