(2) The CFI should, except in the case of ATOs providing flight test training, have completed 1 000 hours of flight time as pilot-in-command (PIC)
This is at an ATO conducting modular or integrated courses, for the CPL, IR and ATPL, not to be confused with small organisations conducting PPL training.
In the good old days the CFI at a PPL school would also have been a PPL examiner and that required 1500 hours instructional time not the current 500 hours under EU regulations, or just 200 hours to examine candidates for a LAPL. Its an odd kind of logic that says if we have a lower level of qualification, the examiner also needs a lower level of knowledge and experience to verify it. Smacks of the blind leading the blind!
I also recall a school where the CFI was an AFI and had to be supervised by a lesser mortal! And perhaps the daftest of all an AFI (ME) who was a CRE (ME) under grandfather rights.
eddsPeter wrote:
To share with you one of mine experiences. Compared to my wife I’m a very experienced pilot, with a lot of hours more than she has. Once when arriving at an airfield I altos gh otherwise adviced I took the wrong landing direction with a lot of tailwind. She told me in flight that I was wrong. I just said “no I’m right”, she stopped to insist and I made the landing. On ground I realised my mistake and we had an argument why she stopped to point out my mistake in flight. The answer was : You are the PIC and you have much more experience then I have.That was a good lesson to learn for me. Never to be overconvinced about what I’m doing is right. Just give room for communication and put more democracy into the cockpit.
What do you think about democracy concepts in the little aircrafts? How fare would you go with it regarding second pilots, instructors or passengers?
The danger is that you will miss some parts of the big picture. For instance, letting one handle the radio and/or the navigation (which is in essence what you are doing with an VFR nav app). Then IF an emergency situation should emerge, the PIC has to take action, but now he has to do it with less overall view of the situation than he otherwise would have had. This has to be weighted up against the fact that two heads think better than one, (even if the other head is a nav app or autopilot), and the probability of entering an emergency situation due to some pilot error (nav, weather related) is diminished.
Legally there IS a difference between PPL and LAPL. A PPL can act both as PIC and as co-pilot. With a LAPL you can only act as a PIC. A single pilot aircraft needs no co-pilot, but as far as I know, there is nothing preventing another pilot to act as co-pilot even though the aircraft does not require one. It’s just that he cannot write anything meaningful in his logbook, and the responsibilities has to be sorted out up front. Besides, a PIC is not required to fly the aircraft, or navigate or any other things except:
(PIC) means the pilot designated as being in command and charged with the safe conduct of the flight
It’s only natural to share the work in my opinion, but a PIC cannot share the command and safe conduct things. A corollary to this is, according to the law, no one else can ever be in command or charged with the safe conduct of the flight. This is what the license is all about, it is not to fly, not to navigate, but to be PIC. You have to show you have the required skills, the medicals and so on. As long as all that is OK, and you operate according to the law, no one else can tell you how to do things, how to delegate, who pushes the buttons etc. You are the captain of the ship, that is what the license say. It doesn’t say you are the captain – but you have to listen to what any arbitrary bureaucrat “feels” or think the “actual meaning of the law” is etc.
I also agree 100% with USflyer, and it is important to sort things out before the flight, and tell passengers (and co pilots) who is the boss.
LeSving wrote:
A PPL can act both as PIC and as co-pilot.
Well, but only in multicrew cockpits. That would rule out the vast majority of all SEP/SET aircraft and a good chunk of multiengine GA-aircraft, so it is of little relevance.
FCL.010 Definitions
[…]
‘Co-pilot’ means a pilot operating other than as pilot-in-command, on an aircraft for which more than one pilot is required, but excluding a pilot who is on board the aircraft for the sole purpose of receiving flight instruction for a licence or rating.
[…]
Furthermore, as the case with the LAPL, Crew Coordination is not part of the PPL syllabus. You will need to gain the MCC competency afterwards (FCL.720.A (d)).
Having said that, FCL.010 further defines:
‘Pilot-in-command’ (PIC) means the pilot designated as being in command and charged with the safe conduct of the flight
That clearly points at no legal problem when delegating tasks to (licensed/pedestrian) passengers. The PIC is responsible, nonetheless. I, as instructor, do recommend to my students to fly together and share the tasks. Not only is it more fun to work together, you can learn a lot from each other and normally two pilots compensate for each pilots weak points.
In the question of interfering in case of immediate danger, I think sanity and reason dictates that to advert death any means are allowed. It is always better to explain why you did something, than letting the BFU (AAIB, AAIU, BEA, TSB, NTSB, etc.) find out why you didn’t do anything. Or in other words, if the emergency enters the cockpit, the rules leave.
A PPL can act both as PIC and as co-pilot.
That comes from ICAO Annex 1 but has never been acheivable in real terms in the UK. To be a co-pilot it would have to be certified for two pilots which means it would be type rated and to fly it you would need the ATPL exams, probably an IR and a Type Rating. The FAA allowed unrated pilots to act as co-pilot but the UK never did. So in essence its a totally useless privilege.
there is nothing preventing another pilot to act as co-pilot even though the aircraft does not require one
There is an official title for them – Passenger
‘Co-pilot’ means a pilot operating other than as pilot-in-command, on an aircraft for which more than one pilot is required,
I screwed up on my post above, its 1000 hours to be a PPL Examiner but only 250 hours as FI compared to 1500 under UK rules. For the LAPL you only need 100 as FI, so in theory you could go from being a Restricted FI to an Examiner in the same week!
