Is IR rating worth if you only fly in the UK?

If for some reason you could not fly outside the UK, the full IR is still handy for a flight like this which becomes much simpler and, in common wx, is done as VMC on top rather than sitting OCAS (and probably getting chucked around / collecting ice) which in the UK is the only other option because of the watertight separation between the Class A services and all the great unwashed below that (Scotland is better though).

Whether I would bother with the full IR just for the UK if I didn’t already have it, I am not sure. It’s easy to judge others when you already have what they are trying to achieve… and the IR is hard work. You aren’t a better pilot than you would be with the IMCR, for a given amount of technical competence, currency on type, and general interest in doing stuff right.

However once you get the IR you are not likely to remain just in the UK. IFR is much the same everywhere and, as mentioned already, you have the huge advantage of speaking English. This angle has generated a massive amount of hot air here before, especially with regard to France (one interesting POV is here) especially when I said I would probably not bother with the full IR if I could never fly abroad, in France or elsewhere, and I hope this doesn’t get repeated

However there are other angles. If e.g. you cannot get a Class 2 medical then you simply cannot fly abroad at all. The NPPL with the medical self declaration is valid only in the UK and while you can use the IMCR with it that is valid only for non-certified planes. And the whole NPPL is scheduled to be rendered invalid by Brussels for certified planes in April 2018. This route is relevant to many pilots. You could fly e.g. an RV on the NPPL with medical self dec and use the IMCR. That is pretty damn good. You would just need to find a RHS with a Class 2 medical (and put him/her in your insurance) to fly to Le Touquet

I’m very much in the same boat myself, just deciding which IR to go for, and reading this has been very interesting.

What are thoughts on the EIR? Sounds like a sensible half way between IR(R) and the full thing. I believe this gives access to class A, but of course needs VFR for landing.

carlmeek wrote:

What are thoughts on the EIR?

I looked at it in detail and honestly I think it’s a waste of time. The TK is the biggest pain for the CBIR, and you have to do exactly the same theory for the EIR. You can do the flying for the CBIR in 2-3 days. The ONLY argument is cost, which is negligible in the long run.

If you search here for EIR you will find loads of threads. I tend to agree it is useless and this appears to be supported by its total failure in the marketplace. I recall that only about 2 pilots in Europe have actually done it. It may be slightly more but it is clearly close to zero. A rating which requires you to declare a mayday to fly an IAP in IMC is useless… of course in practice nobody is going to declare a mayday and will just fly the IAP so you may as well how to fly them correctly.

The biggest pain of the European IR route has always been the TK and the requirement to use an FTO. These have not changed and never will change because changing them would be the most politically painful change ever. The whole idea of European aviation is hung on sitting “proper exams” and studying at a “proper school”. The CBIR just nibbles around the edges a bit, which is why the takeup is barely improved over the old JAA IR.

The EIR needs more than VFR for landing. You need VFR for the entire procedure starting with the SID or STAR and including the IAF. So in most cases you will need to cancel IFR many miles (could be 50) before the airport. I cannot get my head around how this could possibly work in the real world – unless you are flying to Greek islands in the summer. I have read many arguments in its favour but they were mainly inside PPL/IR when I used to be a member and all the people debating in favour were IR holders, and there seems to have been a total failure to get a grip on the biggest factors limiting IR update in Europe – the paragraph above this one.

Well, the EIR would make it much less detectable to do illegal IFR If you have just the IMCR, you are illegal the moment you file a Eurocontrol FP, probably (depending on when you enter Class A etc). With the EIR nobody will really know, because only you the pilot knows your flight conditions for sure. So while many UK pilots have been doing DIY cloud breaks outside the UK, using their IMCR skills, they could not legally file a proper Eurocontrol FP, etc. And with a lot of people watching FR24, and with Mode S being mandatory for most IFR (in CAS) in Europe, this is IMHO a bit dodgy.

Regardless is there any reason not to do an IMC rating?

Conviennent, cost effective, can do it in your own aircraft, from your own grass strip, no 100 mile round trip to your nearest ATO, no nights in a hotel and its quite a capable rating.

Definitely do the IMCR. Best value rating ever.

BTW there is yet another route: IMCR → FAA IR → CBIR

Fernando, here’s another vote for the IMC/IR(R). Affordable, accessible and useful, it will allow you to fly under the IFR and make your own informed decision about whether to “progress” to a higher rating.

Incidentally, I’ve asked this before and never got an answer – perhaps it’s just a daft question: Compared with the relatively simple IR(R) ground school, what part of the CBIR TK exam syllabus is indispensable for safe flight in Class A airspace?

Another two questions: what TK syllabus is currently proposed for the BIR, and when is the BIR likely to be available?

Jacko wrote:

what part of the CBIR TK exam syllabus is indispensable for safe flight in Class A airspace?

I think that you will never know in advance. I have often told the story of making a completely blind landing on a localiser backbeam in the Arctic. It was the only time in my life I had used a backbeam, and the windscreen was completely iced over. I was not prepared for the confusion caused as I went over the LOC aerials, and was not immediately sure which way to turn when on the other side of the aerials (think about it )

IR TK came flooding back to my rescue and I quickly thought through the blue side and the yellow side and knew what to do.

I probably yawned and drummed my fingers as I learned that stuff and then suddenly, 30 years later, it potentially saved my life.

TK is not for normal operations, just as engine failure and fire drills aren’t. It’s for when the chips are down.

Refer to my 17 questions about PBN. I hope you never need to know the answer to most of them; but when you do need to, you’ll really need to!

Half those questions, Timothy, are avionics specific and you won’t learn any of that in the EASA IR TK. Some are important but one needs to learn the avionics one actually has. Of the rest one doesn’t need to know most of it.

IMHO about 10% of the TK is relevant, and for a competent IMCR pilot it is closer to 1%. Personally I learnt nothing from mine (the 7 JAA IR exams). And in that I include the 3 days spent at PAT at EGHH – the theory there was the worst bit.

The icing scenario would appear to be bad planning / embarking on a mission with inadequate alternates / insufficiently capable aircraft / etc. It sounds like something from Fate is the Hunter That’s how aviation was back then. But there is no need for that today.

Europe has no back course approaches. But even that is avionics-specific, because an EHSI shows the deviation correctly.