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Looking for a scenic destination on west coast of Italy - Lucca LIQL?

They’re part of the AIP.

ENR6.

Mainz (EDFZ) & Egelsbach (EDFE), Germany

Great – thanks

I downloaded them, password-stripped them (so they can be strip-printed to a PDF), and on a quick and dirty look they look exactly the same as the 2013 Jepp charts…

The AIP charts are truly horrible. Who can fly with them? References like “Zone 1”…

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

Nobody flies with them. They’re merely the sum of what’s verbally written in the AIP, transposed on a map of Italy, with no claims of readability.

That “zone1”, “zone2” etc. stuff is an italian thing. They don’t have CTAs there, so it’s all CTRs and to differentiate betwween the various bits and pieces composing the whole of the CTR, they give names to the various zones.

Mainz (EDFZ) & Egelsbach (EDFE), Germany

Nobody flies with them

Nobody can fly with them.

There are almost no CAS vertical extent labels:

So, I guess one just flies along the coast, below 2000ft (see label bottom right below) and turns off the radio and the transponder?

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

They are in the chart legend, just to the right.

Mainz (EDFZ) & Egelsbach (EDFE), Germany

It seems almost impossible to reach Lucca from France unless one gets clearances through LIP-2, LID-37A, LIP-3, the Pisa CTR-2 (whose base is 1000-2000 below the ground), LIR-18, etc.

How does this work in practice?

Obviously Pisa LIRP will be the alternate, but how easy is it to get an IFR clearance in Italy?

The low level route to Lucca, clearances permitting, seems to be, from the coast, starting at the VIAREGGIO VRP, to Massarosa, and along the road to Lucca LIQL.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

I don’t recall attempting this, but is it possible to file airways to Pisa and then advise you will be cancelling IFR once VMC on the approach and diverting VFR to Lucca?

The Pisa military ATC are quite helpful and you could call them on the ’phone to discuss?

Oxford (EGTK), United Kingdom

Sure… it’s just that I am doing this bit as a VFR flight, for the benefit of my PPL passenger

If it was me, I would fly IFR to Pisa and jump into a taxi

I will give Pisa OPS a call.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

Done that, the “P” zones are H24 prohibited, the “D” zones can be ATC-cleared by Pisa approach.

However the +39 0583 93 60 62 for Lucca has an Italian message and then hangs up so I can’t check opening hours or fuel. I have emailed them.

Just called Pisa handling (mandatory). NO AVGAS. PPR application (even if filing as alternate) to genav at pisa-airport dot c o m. The man says the costs are below €100. So that’s a viable alternate.

No reply from Lucca at all so I called a mobile number listed in Navbox and got a man who says they close at sunset and have avgas

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

It seems almost impossible to reach Lucca from France unless one gets clearances through LIP-2, LID-37A, LIP-3, the Pisa CTR-2 (whose base is 1000-2000 below the ground), LIR-18, etc.

How does this work in practice?

It is not possible to get clearances for prohibited areas. This is true everywhere is the world I guess. that’s why they are prohibited areas.

Danger Areas you can just fly through in Italy. Not strictly required to be talking to anybody. Obviously ATC still likes to “approve” transits, but that’s rather nonsense. It’s restricted areas that can be crossed after coordination with ATC.

Pisa CTR2 is from 3000 feet MSL up.

In practice, one flies Genoa, then SPEZI and then via Viareggio to Pisa. No clearance required for that below 3000.

Last Edited by boscomantico at 19 Nov 21:00
Mainz (EDFZ) & Egelsbach (EDFE), Germany
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