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Exchange Autopilot options for a TB20

I am currently into maybe buying a TB10 and this one has no autopilot.

Given that you are flying 350-500 hours a year I would say a TB10 would be a significant downgrade for you, especially if the autopilot doesn’t do pitch trim and doesn’t do ILS

The Trio AP for me is a toy, unsuitable for the serious IFR market.

Indeed, but would you like to bet how many will have one installed and discover these limitations only afterwards?

the capabilities of a KFC225 or 150 which are not available as refits.

At some point, within the past few years, HBK announced they will sell the KFC225 as a retrofit. I don’t know what happened to that. But it wasn’t cheap – some $40k, from vague memory.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

A further update from the US on the STEC 3100:

So, basically, this is unlikely to ever happen. They are looking at 1-2 years starting from the point where they have found the 15 customers, and so far there are nowhere near 15 customers showing up.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

@Peter, are you on that list? You can change your mind at any time later, it’s not binding.

LRIA, Romania

No; my KFC225 is working well now. Also, with a “120hrs” average install time this is a very expensive project. For next winter I may be looking at doing the centre stack for LPV but that’s about it.

I don’t think you can change your mind; they want 15 contractually binding orders. A “non binding order” is what you normally get with these group funding situations, it is completely worthless, and it usually leads to almost nobody coming up with any money and the whole initiative collapses. Ask any avionics shop that develops STCs…

I think the reason they are struggling to find the 15 is because they are looking mainly in the US where you can still get autopilots repaired fairly successfully. A good pre-GT TB is worth only maybe 2x the autopilot installation cost, and an early TB20 is worth only about 1×. It is only on the GTs that anyone would spend money, and most of those owners are either staying put (with a working aircraft) or are looking at buying an SR22 for “family reasons” (the chute)

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

The KFC230 has the TB20 on its AML list but currently it excludes a flight director, so no replacement for a KFC box.

As noted in the above linked thread, this product has some substantial gotchas in its pricing (due to extra stuff needed).

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

The KFC230 now claims to be certified.

Curiously the TB21 is not on the list.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

From the US:

More info from the Genesys in regard to the 3100 from Genesys. Big issue at least with all the TB-10’s and some TB-20’s, if you do not have electric trim, that will add a significant amount of cost to the install if and when we get the first one installed. Electric trim can be done but adds 12-18K to the install.

The lack of an electric trim was mentioned earlier in this thread. It is really a crippled autopilot.

The STEC3100 doesn’t look like it will be approved for the TB line, due to a lack of confirmed interest.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

That means there is no modern, digital alternative to the aging analog A/Ps installed in the TB20?

I have an STEC 60-2 with electric trim and altitude preselector that will do everything combined with a GPSS converter, however I wouldn’t mind a snappier attitude based, digital A/P.

Any advice?

LRIA, Romania

Well, if you want attitude based and digital, you have the KFC225

That was Honeywell’s tour de force, after which most of their engineers left (c. 2002).

Except for a software bug (the full story is slowly coming out and is more complicated) which burns out the servos, it is very reliable and probably as good as any other autopilot.

Those who don’t want the KFC225 (most TB GTs had that factory installed) went to the STEC 55X which works well enough.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

It’s been reported on the US Socata site that Garmin are interested in seeing how much interest there would be in the GFC500 STC for the Socata TBs – here.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom
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