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Garmin GTN650 and Avidyne EX600

On the range circle at 350 degrees you have the cyan heading cursor, at 340 degrees the green Track cursor and the magenta Desired Track cursor. The cyan flags are the METARS, and you see the DL radar displayed as well.

EGTF, LFTF

Looks like you have the GTN750, EX600 and tucked away somewhere the MLX770

That's a nice level of integration.

The EX600 display looks at least as sharp as the GTN750 one.

The problem is I don't have the vertical stack room for the two.

I wonder why Avidyne didn't implement a "track ahead" (called "course"?) line - as a dotted line perhaps?

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

I've just been reading some stuff on the EX600.

One quite relevant thing is that for $200/year you get worldwide (more to the point European) airport charts, mostly georeferenced.

That really is very useful - so long as one doesn't have to update them all the time i.e. so long as the function doesn't get terminated after say 2 months like Jeppview terminal charts are.

The question, as before, is whether one should go for a 430W or the 650 as the GPS. I wonder what exactly the 650 would offer, on an N-reg, in the European scenario where you want PRNAV and LPV, and (in my case) compatibility with all the "old" gear like a Shadin Microflo totaliser (which presumably connects to the GPS, not to the MFD), and the KFC225 autopilot. I have a SN3500 EHSI which can do roll steering on its FCS outputs, provided it gets ARINC429 from the GPS.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

Peter,

If the choice is between the 14 year old technology GNS430 with the W upgrade or the new technology GTN650, then the choice is obvious as the GTN650 will be supported well into the future and has a slightly less annoying user interface than the GNS430W. Otherwise they will both support the same stuff. However, the GTN750 stands so far above the GTN650 and includes a full function MFD, there is no comparison and this is the only future looking choice from Garmin you should consider. I assume by now you have downloaded the free trainer from Garmin that simulates both the GTN650 and GTN750 and appreciate the user interface issues with the GTN650 verses the GTN750. Also with roll steering built in to your KFC225, what has the SN3500 got to offer in this regard.

KUZA, United States

I'm sorry Peter buy I'm pretty sure this information is just wrong. We have the EX500 and for around 200 Euro you get an update of the airspace database. The chart view feature requires a Jeppesen subscription with the MFD option. The MFD option is only a little more expensive than the normal Jepp subscription but the regular Jepp prices are what they are. IFR Europe is somewhere around 1700 Euro. Therefore we just have the VFR subscription. This way we have VFR approach charts and very important the georeferenced taxi charts. The IFR package is just not worth the expenses. We need the EX500 to control our radar but else I think this class of devices is just too expensive. Mount a Garmin 695 or similar in the panel and you will get a lot more features for a fraction of the costs. There is no need to have a fully certified device for displaying this kind of information.

www.ing-golze.de
EDAZ

@sebastian

i have a feeling you are both right ...

As I understood it from Jepp you need the jeppview subscription and the you only pay a few 100 extra as it counts as a fifth screen?

P.s. Peter .. The display you like will also be like that on the ifd540 .. Eventually

Yes just as an example here are the two products. You can see the difference is not big but the base price is high and there is still eastern Europe missing.

Base subscription:

Subscription with MFD option:

www.ing-golze.de
EDAZ

NCYankee - what I like about a "dedicated MFD" is that one can view stuff on it that is totally unrelated to the current flight. But maybe a GTN750 can do that. I will look into it better. I am not actually doing any of this until PRNAV enroute has firmed up a bit, one way or the other.

I guess the one big advantage of a GTN is the airway entry, which will save time.

Incidentally I think the 430W is a complete new board inside; all that is original is the user interface.

Also you know I like old proven equipment, not new stuff with a long list of bugs

The SN3500 does roll steering through its autopilot (FCS) output. This has the advantage that the EHSI display is always showing what the autopilot is doing, which one doesn't get when bypassing everything and driving the autopilot directly from the GPS using ARINC429.

The IFR package is just not worth the expenses.

Yes; I am aware that there is no cheap way to get Jepp terminal charts, and all of Europe is going to cost you some €2000 no matter what platform you buy it for, and I would never pay that. But it looked like (and Avidyne claim) that the airport charts are much less. I didn't check that. Maybe just USA is $200, in which case they are grossly misleading.

A 695 alone (or a 430 alone) is IHMO no good; the screens are too small.

Also, anecdotal evidence suggests the KX radios are a lot better than the built-in Garmin radios. I don't know if the GTN improves on this. I would want to keep at least one of my KX radios, because it can be wired direct to the battery (via a CB and switch) for ground use and emergency purposes.

I will download the GTN750 trainer and will see how useful the 750 is as an MFD.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

Peter, what about the Moving Terrain MFD? it has been on my wish list for a long time and it seems to do everything you are looking for. The resolution of the screen is very high and it seems to be a very flexible product.

ORTAC

I think that unit is too wide. I can use only the standard centre stack width.

I think I have these options:

GNS430W/GTN650 on the bottom
EX600/GTN750 on the top

The upper KX radio will be lost

So the total stack height available is a KX155A+KLN94+KMD550.

An alternative is just one unit which presently could be only the GTN750. The IFD540 or the KSN770 are vapourware. But I don't like the way the screen is occupied when changing the flight plan, etc, whereas with an MFD you can play around with route changes on the GPS and the MFD reflects them when they are done. The two units work a lot better.

And I don't have room for two "big" boxes e.g. 2x 750 or 2x anything like a KSN770. Well, not without losing both KX radios and I am not doing that.

But maybe by the time I get around to actually doing this, the KSN770 will be out and will turn out to be working well... I just don't have much confidence that either Avidyne or Honeywell have in-house resources to fix bugs on these, if the initial sales are less than great.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom
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