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GNS430W to GTN650xi? or GTN750xi?

My 5 cents since I am doing a full installation of a Garmin package. Sorry but the tablet does not allow to use quotes (or I am not proficient enought).
By9468840: The IDF cannot drive the GFC500, in your case, the G5 does it. And that is why you don’t have VNAV and the use of the TO/GA button. Same reason you don’t have Garmin Smart Glide, it is only driven by the GNS 750/650. The G3X can also drive the GFC 500, but requires a G5 as a backup anyway, so both can do it.

I will maintain the GNS 430 (non WAAS), irrespective the non compatibility with the GTN 650 xi. I will use it as a backup 8,33 radio and I can also continue to play with it as a GPS, having also a VFR GPS use only integrated into the G3X.

The rational for the 650 xi instead of the 750 was value for money and panel realestate. With the G3X, most of the visual capacities that the 750 provides against the 650 are there, expect the visualization of the procedures, which the size of the 650 makes it difficult but not impossible.

LPSR, Portugal

lmsl1967 wrote:

With the G3X, most of the visual capacities that the 750 provides against the 650 are there, expect the visualization of the procedures, which the size of the 650 makes it difficult but not impossible.

I suspect you will use the iPad for this, right? Also, I’m curious what you gain with the upgrade since you have a nice display with the G3X. As someone who’s spent my career in the tech industry, I always try to wait as long as possible to upgrade, because things are always moving. If there’s no compelling reason to switch (regulatory, significant capability enhancement, or maintenance issues), I will try to skip at least one product generation. The reason is that shortly after you install something it’s out of date.

In any case good luck with your project, and hope Garmin’s lead time doesn’t hit you too badly!

EHRD, Netherlands

IMHO it is wrong to rely on a tablet for a key component of flying. The whole flight, including the whole departure/arrival/IAP, should be doable using the panel mounted stuff.

Tablets fail far too often… Yes I know lots of people will now jump in and say they have never had a tablet shut down

Tablets are for backups, and for non-key parts e.g. writing down the ATIS or writing down clearances (if you can stand the horrid handwriting interfaces) because you have a backup in the form of a pen and paper.

If one is spending 5 digits, I would absolutely not spend it on a box with a 430/440/650 sized LCD and without having a much bigger LCD somewhere already. Those are OK for displaying the waypoint list, the landing fuel on board, and to act as a keypad

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

@Peter this amused me as I remember ploughing airways before EuroGA with a couple of VORs, ADF and DME (RNAV was a KNS80). It feels over a century ago, mobile phones weighed around half a kilo. You also had calculus hacks to run calculations on the old HP calculators for business. This must have been around Lotus 1-2-3 era. Your moving map was the Jepp IFR chart. In central Europe you were using old USA one mill charts for topography.

On another forum someone posted a comment that when Delta acquired NWA the MD-80 fleet just had VORs, ADF (probably two) and a DME.

I still feel nostalgia for the old four course ranges, no displays at all, just the null sound of A and N cancelling each other out.

Oxford (EGTK), United Kingdom

Peter wrote:

IMHO it is wrong to rely on a tablet for a key component of flying. The whole flight, including the whole departure/arrival/IAP, should be doable using the panel mounted stuff.

The iPad reference was about procedure visualization, by which I presume he meant geo-referenced plates. My 530W doesn’t have this, and I use the iPad for the plates (including geo-referencing). Your KLN94 also doesn’t have geo-referenced plates, so I presume you are relying on either a tablet or paper charts for this.

EHRD, Netherlands

Yes it’s funny how time moves along

Yes I use paper charts for IAPs, but for the general (enroute) view of the route ahead (harrassing ATC for shortcuts, which is the principal cockpit task, apart from watching the LFOB, and sometimes the ETA even though 99% of the time you cannot do anything about it anyway ) nothing beats a decent size display.

If you can get that display on your tablet, and have this instantly updating as you amend it on the panel mount box (which I don’t have except the KLN94 waypoint list does get continuously exported to the ADL app; not sure if this can be done with Foreflight?) that’s nice, but only until the tablet packs up. Then you lose this forward visibility.

Even my prehistoric 320×240 KMD550 is far better than a GNS430 sized display.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

Peter wrote:

Even my prehistoric 320×240 KMD550 is far better than a GNS430 sized display.

I don’t disagree there at all, which is why I mentioned earlier that I’d be looking to update as well if I had a 430. And FWIW I agree with your assessment in general, just not sure whether I’d get a 750 just for the geo-referenced plates. The 430W + Aera with panel mount would give you the same capability at a fraction of the cost and complexity. Add in a FlightStream and you basically never need to touch the 430 except to tune frequencies.

EHRD, Netherlands

@Dutch_Flyer: iPad are not certified, you can visualize on 650 and I am not sure on the split screen of the G3X before you load it.

@Peter, I am almost sure that you cannot plan dep/arr on the G3X due to VFR limitations but youi can see it there once the FP uploaded into the 650. Problem sometimes is dimensions, my case I am already having a remote transponder, didn’t wanrt to have more remote devivrs neither the GFC 500 in a plane not the frontal. I have seen the A/P installed on the lower left side (where the old A/P is but I don’t agree with it). It is all about compromise.

My decision argument for garmin instead of the Dynon IFD combination was the GFC500, for me a game changer on the A/P current offer.

I will have an iPad install to on the copilot side (approved the exceed expenses today), will be connected throught FStream 510 into the system, allowing split screen with garmin pilot with syntectic vision and other functions like check lists or maps.

I will have a second iPad with skydemon and charts (this last I can also have on the split screnn window of the G3X.

@Peter 5 upper digits :-(

LPSR, Portugal

Of course, one can fly on G430+HSI only but his tablet still ring few bells:
- Stansted CTA at 1500ft while he is IMC at 800ft
- Wind turbine at 3500ft climb to 4000ft
- Traffic -500ft in Golf clouds

GTN750 bring back many of those useful features in the cockpit, surely if one is flying VOR-VOR airways above published MEA or in graceful hands of ATC above published MVA, then they won’t need big plasma screens

If one is flying freestyle MSA in complex airspace & terrain, then bigger screens are better…

Next will be Synt-Vision display

Last Edited by Ibra at 24 May 14:23
Paris/Essex, France/UK, United Kingdom

GA_Pete wrote:

Is it not possible to restart production of equivalent parts? Surely it’s possible.

Not really. Many parts become obsolete and are no longer produced, often during the production period and a manufacturer using the pars will purchase a last order supply that covers anticipated usage including maintenance. Once those parts are gone, no one in business is likely to re-engineer a product to use new parts and in the case of avionics, recertify an old system with the new parts.

KUZA, United States
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