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New Garmin COM/NAV

In time for the upcoming 8.33kHz swap in Europe, Garmin have released new COM/NAV devices.

The devices look quite capable and I guess they will dominate the upgrade market.

If Garmin provided financial contributions to the people that wrote the 8.33kHz bill, it looks like it's was money very well spent.

There are some neat features there - very tempting for when my ageing KNS80 finally gives up the ghost. The "virtual" DME functionality (when paired with a GPS) is particularly nice - I can see how this works with a VOR, but I wonder how this works in practice on an ILS. If they can figure this out, and can produce a document that clearly says this is acceptable as a substitute for a DME, I would install one tomorrow.

Does anyone know if Bendix-King are planning an upgrade to the KX-155 series?

Also, what difference does the extra 6 watts of transmit power make? The inverse square law would suggest it's about 25% more, which doesn't seem much. I've only once had someone complain they couldn't understand me properly (London Military at about FL100 between Brize and Gloucester, no idea where their receiver was located).

EGEO

Does anyone know if Bendix-King are planning an upgrade to the KX-155 series?

I would say zero. There appears to be no development activity for GA at Honeywell. It all stopped about 10 years ago. They had a go with the KFD840 and the KSN770 (which were developed by some subcontractor) but those got abandoned because they found the software was written in a manner which prevented it getting certified. They got picked up again in some sort of joint venture with Aspen, but it's much too late.

Also you can get 8.33 with the KX165A. That is what I did. I got a KX165A from South East Aerospace in Florida, with an 8130-3 which is also good for a G-reg if the item is new. If the item is overhauled then it needs to be a dual-release 8130-3 which SE Aero can do also.

The KX165A is a plug-in replacement for a KX155A but going from a KX155 (non "A") to a KX165A requires the connector to be rewired.

Also, what difference does the extra 6 watts of transmit power make?

IMHO, a bit, obviously, but I wouldn't pay much for it.

The KX "A" radios are actually very good bits of kit, and well proven over about 10 years. I would never buy anything that has just come out, in aviation

If Garmin provided financial contributions to the people that wrote the 8.33kHz bill, it looks like it's was money very well spent.

I am 100.000% sure that Garmin did not lobby the EU to drop that proposal

It's all good money for them and the dealers, in these hard times.

However I should add that the only people who need 8.33 are those with the full IR. There is no practical way to fly in the affected airspace on the UK IMCR privileges, and abroad you are limited to VFR.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

"However I should add that the only people who need 8.33 are those with the full IR." Are you sure? By 31 DEC 2017 every balloon, ultralight and glider, as well as the rest of us, VFR and IFR, are required to have 8.33 capability - here in Denmark. Are we alone in that requirement in this small country? - that does not seem to make sense.

Anyway, Bendix King has long had a COM with 8.33. My KY165B brochure is from 2002 and it brags about 8.33. I have never seen one for real, though.

For our VFR-planes, especially the motor glider, we are looking at the Becker 6401 for 8.33 capability. It is small and lightweight, has intercom with squelch, and dual watch capability. But the new Garmin GTR225 has a nicer (bigger) panel and is probably easier for the pilot to work with.

For our IFR aircraft with a GNS430 + an old navcom, the new Garmin GNC255 could be a contender, if twin 8.33 capability will be required in the future. I am not sure about that.

huv
EKRK, Denmark

You could well be right about 2017...

The "IFR enroute" requirement became active late 2012.

This could be very expensive, for the VFR community. I paid more for the KX165A than I would have paid for a Mode S (GTX330) installation.

I have asked around whether 1 or 2 8.33 radios will be needed. Nobody seems to know and the most plausible report I have heard is that it depends on whose airspace you are flying in. The UK needs just 1.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

is there a cost associated with database up keep.

personally i would want something dirt cheap and ideally pin compatable. with the 720 channel box two.

I have asked around whether 1 or 2 8.33 radios will be needed. Nobody seems to know and the most plausible report I have heard is that it depends on whose airspace you are flying in. The UK needs just 1.

This is a requirement of the airplane equipment regulations. These are national regulations that apply to aircraft on the country's registry. Therefore if the UK only requires 1 COM, you can legally fly in all ICAO countries with just 1 COM. Germany requires 2 COMs for IFR and therefore even when flying my D-reg in the UK, I need 2 COMs.

I'm hoping that a EU directive will replace the national avionics regulations and that it will not be modelled after the current German regulation. However, it might come too late and require a costly replacement.

Achim,

I dont mean to sound rude in the slightest but do you have it on reasonable authority that both comms need to be 8.33 capable?

The reason I ask is that I fly a D reg mooney (maintenance at Flugzeugwerft Moeller in Hangelar) and I got their standard circular (executing their CAMO function i suppose) explaining the need for 8.33 but it didn't specify all (or both should I say) radios need to be 8.33 spaced. I'm keen to know for sure as I have a 430 but with a KX155. I tried asking the workshop to clarify but they seem reluctant to say (im not sure if its because they're 'too busy' to reply or they're not sure!). I can stumble along in German but my comprehension is far from good enough to go to the LBA rules and regs to be able to figure this out for myself! Hence the 'help!' Plea!

I'm presuming (Germany being Germany :)) and from what you say, that both will need 8.33 spacing- but it'd be nice to have it confirmed from some source that both radios need it before I go throwing money around on an upgrade if it isn't needed!

Peter, AIUI the KX 165A is 28v only, is that right? Does than mean its a non-option for a 14 v machine or is a transformer a sensible option? (Intuitively feel transformers are for getting round pegs into square holes and only sensible if no other options apply!)

Congratulations Peter on (another) great site. Youve got it right given the speedy growth of the community!

Thanks

Justin

EGNV and Fishburn Airfield

Justin,

it's not 100% clear yet because even though the European law is in effect (requiring 8.33kHz from 2014), the German bill requiring 2 COMs for single pilot IFR could theoretically change until the 8.33kHz comes into effect. However, there is no indication that it will actually change.

I've read through both law texts and as it stands today, you will need two 8.33kHz capable COMs for a D-reg aircraft because the German law makes 2 COMs mandatory equipment and the European law requires the mandatory COMs to have 8.33kHz channel spacing.

Very annoying (got a KX-155A) but I will wait until next year. Maybe I will (incorrectly) conclude that the 2nd COM does not have to be 8.33kHz capable and see what happens.

I can stumble along in German but my comprehension is far from good enough to go to the LBA rules and regs to be able to figure this out for myself!

The LBA (CAA) is not really the driver here, it's the law and its implementation rules.

the KX 165A is 28v only

Just checked the IM and the MM and yes 28V only.

I am not sure a 165A is the best option unless you want to replace a 155A, in which case it's probably the simplest way. The 165A is a great radio, very clear and reliable, but it is pricey.

I know nothing specific about 12/24V inverters but all this stuff exists - example (not exactly cheap, but you may need 24V for other stuff).

In the UK, it appears you need just one 8.33 radio. That is just one person's interpretation though. Personally I wouldn't care less, so long as I had just one. Below FL200, it would be extraordinarily bad luck to be assigned any 8.33 frequency, let alone two in a rapid succession.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom
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