It is interesting to see an event such as this supported by film. (I am guessing this video can be viewed outside the UK? If not a VPN should do the trick).
The Airprox report has also been published which gives more insight.
[dead link]
There is some interesting discussion about the use of a traffic service.
As a North American, I find this type of incident appalling. Undoubtedly there was radar coverage in this part of the UK, but because of the ATC and FISO job descriptions and airspace constructs it prevents proper service from being provided to the traffic (the IFR traffic especially!).
Of course there are far reaches of North America where there is no radar and IFR traffic are mixing with VFR traffic when the weather is nice. However, in any major centre there is full radar coverage and the IFR traffic will receive full traffic service all the way to the tower controller (without having to ask for it, or risk having their flight plan dumped). In major centres the controlling unit always organises a hand off to the next sector, it is seamless, as you would expect IFR to be.
I am sure nothing will change, but for a first world country with a strong aviation background, I find the UK ridiculous.
Welcome to uncontrolled airspace… It is called “uncontrolled” for a reason. All these services they seek to provide are nice to have, but – at least in my part of the world – there is no guarantee that they actually have the time to look after you. Also a large number of aircraft in this airspace are not squawking and are therefore invisible to radar and TCAS.
It is a important issue this raises. It is easy when descending out of CAS to go blasting into class G in a fast aircraft. On Sunday I was given a descent, just after being told call the A/G operator i had a traffic alert and stopped the descent. A Cirrus passed 900ft below me. Had I continued down it could have been very close indeed. See and avoid with a 100knots closing speed is nearly impossible.
It says a few hundred feet. That happens frequently in UK class G on nice days
One day I will get a video too.
The real question is whether the light one had his transponder on……. Any offers? The jet had TCAS.
Presumably Jason’s Cirrus was likewise invisible.
Nobody in authority will admit that ATC is nothing to do with this.
The radar returns in the linked documents seem to show the two aircraft squawking 7000 and 1177 respectively in Figures 3 & 4.
Although in the earlier Figure 2 the C42 does not appear to have a squawk assigned to it? I don’t know anything about ATC, so I can’t comment on whether this is normal or not.
I would consider traffic with transponder as known traffic and info about known traffic is supposed to be given even in i G airspace..?
Peter wrote:
The real question is whether the light one had his transponder on……. Any offers? The jet had TCAS.Read the report, please!
what_next wrote:
Welcome to uncontrolled airspace… It is called “uncontrolled” for a reason. All these services they seek to provide are nice to have, but – at least in my part of the world – there is no guarantee that they actually have the time to look after you. Also a large number of aircraft in this airspace are not squawking and are therefore invisible to radar and TCAS.
In this case, both aircraft were squawking and they were both visible on radar. It is almost inconceivable that the jet was in contact with FIS which (as Peter claims) have access to radar but is (according to the airprox report) forbidden to make use of it!
The UK needs to completely rethink its FIS system but (as Canuck said) that will probably never happen.
Sorry, have just the phone today. Was it radiating mode C?
Almost nobody talks to FIS in the UK because they cannot offer a useful service most of the time. People talk to radar units such as Farnborough. But much OCAS traffic talks to nobody and turn off the transponder…