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Hello everybody (US experimental in Europe)

Hello everybody,

while i am a member since some time, i never really introduced myself.
Most of the time i was a silent reader till now and just took advantage of the huge knowledge base .

I’m 31 and work here in Wuerzburg, Germany at the University as a research assistant.
My research field is aerospace information technology, which mainly means software for satellites and drones.
In the end a Phd might be nice – but that would mean less flying more writing .

I finished my PPL last year in autumn at a local club. Took me 2 years – which is quite normal here (training only on weekends and from April to October).
Since April now I’m together with two friends owner of a US registered experimental plane. A Jabiru J400.
While looking like an ultralight, it is a 4 seater and and has a MTOW of 700kg. Switching from the c172 and c152 to this, was actually no problem.


This photo was taken at the first fly-in i visited in Gelnhausen (near Frankfurt).

My next goal is to fly to croatia (inspired by some trip reports here).
This will be my first trip to another country and with our experimental it will require additional paperwork for flight permits – we will see how that all works out.

Greets,
Tobias (yesombre)

EDGH

Hello Tobias,

I suspect Peter will be along soon to welcome you

You may be the only poster here who owns and flies an N-registered Experimental category aircraft in Europe. The requirements to do so, and the German annual permit situation have been discussed but I don’t recall any first hand accounts being posted. It has the potential to vastly simplify maintenance and inspections so will I think be of interest. If I could build an N-registered RV where I live in the US, then transport it later to Germany and fly it there, that could potentially be the easiest way for me to own and maintain a plane in Europe.

There are a lot of foreign registered experimentals in Germany, with N-reg probably being the most popular. The situation in Germany is very liberal, you can do basically what you like and the annual permit is a simple formality. If the US document lists IFR, the German permit will include that (possibly by accident but the wording right now is very clear, allowing all operations that the FAA allow with that airplane). My hangar neighbor has owned N-reg experimentals for a long time, without any trouble.

Its quites straight forward here in Germany. They want a fax with all aircraft documents as well as names and US licenses of all pilots.
After 4-5 days one receives a letter with a permit to fly 180 days per year. Registration with FAA has to be via a Trust, but that is no big problem either (and not that expensive).
So as long as one flies within Germany everything is fine.

I did some small research for my planed trip to Croatia. Croatia seems to be no problem, if i interpret the AIP correct.
Austrias AIP however states:
“Operators of home-built aircraft, which do not fulfil above mentioned conditions may in reasonable individual cases state an application for exemptions.”
So depends on “reasonable individual case” – i will find out when i write them.

EDGH

Thanks for the info. I’ve seen N-registered Experimentals in Germany but have never been in touch directly with an owner.

achimha wrote:

If the US document lists IFR, the German permit will include that (possibly by accident but the wording right now is very clear, allowing all operations that the FAA allow with that airplane)

This is not an issue – any aircraft can be flown IFR on N-register assuming it has the equipment required by the FARs, 2-year static and transponder check, and unless it is explicitly denied. I imagine ‘VFR and IFR’ could be explicitly written into the FAA C of A if you requested that of the DAR at issuance.

yesombre wrote:

Registration with FAA has to be via a Trust, but that is no big problem either (and not that expensive).

I’d maintain US residency (no trust) and would not establish EU residency so would not anticipate either aircraft or EU pilot licensing to be an issue. The N-registered Experimental AB Category aircraft would stay in the EU permanently (i.e. for a period of several years) but I’d be a visitor. I’d do the maintenance and annual inspections myself and ‘pickle’ the engine after each visit.

Thanks again for the info. I’m looking forward to hearing how your international flights go.

Last Edited by Silvaire at 22 Jul 16:09

Silvaire wrote:

This is not an issue – any aircraft can be flown IFR on N-register assuming it has the equipment required by the FARs, 2-year static and transponder check, and unless it is explicitly denied. I imagine ‘VFR and IFR’ could be explicitly written into the FAA C of A if you requested that of the DAR at issuance.

It doesn’t have to be written, just allowed. It is something “special” because the ECAC regulations say that experimentals can only be operated under VFR. So with the current way it works, Germany grants you an IFR privilege on N-reg experimentals. I am quite sure this was never intended…

PS: The 180 days is not for the purpose of basing but for the purpose of using the aircraft. Now show me one experimental aircraft that flies on 180 days per year. Usually they are unairworthy for 360 days a year

Any experimental aircraft can be flown IFR but just not anywhere…

Look at the many threads on this topic in the Non Certified section.

The worst restricted non ICAO CofA planes are N reg ones. Even parking is limited… 28 days in the UK for example. Most countries ban IFR in homebuilts also, as an airspace rule, so having an unrestricted permit does not help much.

You don’t need to watch FR24 for long to see who is and is not doing what. It is consequently obvious what the flying patterns are. If you want IFR then a homebuilt is a very bad way to go about it. Unless you just want to drill holes in clouds, IFR cannot be done below the radar. You won’t get done but your insurance won’t be valid on an illegal flight.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

Peter, if I were flying an FAA E-AB in Europe my flying would avoid contact with any ATC to the greatest extent possible, and filing any flight plans except where legally mandated, never mind IFR. I’d be interested in whether you can get in and out of Italy from Germany without hassles, as well as Croatia. If you can’t, I’d stay in Germany, CZ and vicinity.

Obviously the attraction of doing what I described would be zero interaction with maintenance authorities or similar licensing issues

For both Germany-Italy and Croatia you need a VFR flight plan.

No fpl is necessary VFR from/to Germany and Austria, CZ and Poland, and (i think? Belgium. For those countries you only need a fpl if your destination is a controlled airport with a control zone.

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