Menu Sign In Contact FAQ
Banner
Welcome to our forums

Single shaft dual magnetos e.g. D3000 - why were they used, and are they safe?

Kind of strange that no one has made a certified drop in replacement based on up to date technology

I know I have been known to go off on a rant but you have hit the nail on the head there.

One of the things which p1sses me off about GA, and I am talking generally here, is how many people will openly criticise one product which is openly known to be sub-optimal (like e.g. magnetos) and how many people will openly praise another product (or keep very quiet when it is discussed) which is privately known to be sub-optimal.

Especially if the latter is something that happens to be installed on their plane, or it is a plane they are trying to sell, etc.

From the torrent of emails which I get from other pilots, and from pilots I meet up with face to face, I hear about a lot of stuff which often cannot be talked about openly. It could be because somebody is trying to sell their plane, or it could be due to litigation threats (actually made, or likely expected). And 99% of that stuff never comes out into the open. Most people prefer to get rid of the product quietly.

So it wouldn’t surprise me if some product, sold into a slice of the homebuilt market, was actually a pile of crap. Talking generally of course, and not referring to engines at all. Whereas if you flog something to 1000 Bonanza owners in America, and it’s crap, it will be all over some US forum in 24hrs, and the manufacturer will be on the forum answering questions. Even Garmin post on certain US forums (reluctantly).

This is what makes due diligence (on product reliability) so damn hard. I have made my TB20GT hard to sell with this but I don’t care. On the Socata owners’ group they deride that data, but they would. They chucked me out in 2008

Speaking of Rotax engines, they are much more modern that Lycos/Contis, obviously, but a Lyco or Conti doesn’t need any servicing either, beyond the trivial. Mine has done 1600hrs airborne time (a lot more “tach” time, for those who use that method) and apart from the crank swap has been fine. You can more easily abuse a Lyco/Conti or leave it out to rust, and that is probably where a Rotax scores, in the same way a car engine can be left for months and doesn’t go rusty inside. AND that is a big problem in GA, where a lot of owners fly 10-30hrs/year.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

Depends what you call trivial. Adjusting injection @ 100 hours? Not even on a Trabbi or a 1970 Dacia I had to do that.

@Shorrick_Mk2 I could organize a mechanic apprenticeship for you at my boat company. Top modern common rail diesel Volvo Penta engines. You’d be surprised at what cost fuel efficiency, clean exhaust and quiet operation come. And instead of taking a hammer and chisel to fix the Lycoming, it takes expensive diagnostics computers, super expensive spare parts. And of course 80% of all errors are sensor failures but that doesn’t matter much because the engine refuses to run.

These modern engines are good if the surroundings are suitable and the mechanics are very well trained. The American 1950s stuff is great if you don’t have any of that.

The computer and the VADIS CD (running on a virtual machine) and interface cable I have already… When can I start? I come already trained on the whole engine series, from the 240 to the 460 to the 850 to the S60…. Will work for food and board and free dives :-)

Last Edited by Shorrick_Mk2 at 01 Aug 14:43

A guy on the US TB user group searched the NTSB database and found the following:

120 references turned up, in Cessnas, Pipers, Mooneys, Rockwells, Grummans and TBs.

Of 50 reports out of 120 examined, 10 listed mag failure as a cause of the accident. Those 10/50 * 120 reports = 24 dual mag failures in 46 years.

In 8 of those 10, they found that maintenance of the mags to be the cause. 4 of the maintenance failures were in Mooney M20Js where the mags have to be attached using a detailed procedure which the mechanics did not follow. Another 2 of the mags were improperly installed. Another 2 were not properly lubricated. 2 failed for undetermined reasons (one was badly corroded, indicating improper maintenance).

In half of the mag failures, there were no or minor injuries. It appears that those were mostly cases with only partial power loss.

Lastly, there were 6 Socata TB accidents included in the 120. None of those accidents were due to mag failures.

The conclusion is that the dual magnetos are a low risk, especially in the TB aircraft – provided they are maintained.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom
45 Posts
Sign in to add your message

Back to Top