Peter_G wrote:
Make sure both your handheld radio & your phone are fully charged. Likewise, have the facility to use them via your headphones (either by leads or Bluetooth) since the aircraft noise and/or the ability to hold them somewhere in the cockpit to get a good signal will be greatly reduced.
+1 This is excellent advice.
Sometimes handheld range is a problem. I had a comms antenna installed behind the cabin next to my ELT antenna, with a coax cable to a jack next to my mic plugs. I have a short coax cable to finish the connection from there to the antenna jack on the handheld, which gives the handheld an external antenna and should improve range considerably. I also have an adapter y-cable to plug my headphones into the handheld, as suggested …. bought it at AERO one year.
Another possibility is using the ADL SMS function if one can find a usable/textable tel number for ATC. In the video ATC contacted him, but that might or might not work with a mobile phone in Europe, depending on a lot of things. In any case, my FPL always have my cell number.
@Boscomantico is right about having a plan independent of all the regs. Squawking 7600, staying VMC if encountered, and having the handheld/phone options working are likely the most important 1-2-3. The rest should depend on the situation.
Peter_G wrote:
I find it bizarre – if not an actual safety risk – that in the 21st Century Europe (unlike the whole of the USA) still have different procedures dependent on which territory one is overflying. If I have a Radio failure over Brussels en route from the U.K. to Germany (for me a frequent route) I have to comply with __Belgium __ regulations from their AIP – if I can find them in an emergency – rather than those from where I’ve come from, or those to where I am going.
Is that really true? AFAIU, the same basic procedures apply over the whole of the ICAO EUR region. On the other hand, individual airports can have very different (and detailed) CF arrival procedures.
As a FYI, here is a schematic that explains the FAA regs. To be read left to right and flown accordingly:
https://www.faasafety.gov/files/gslac/courses/content/38/483/Lost%20Com%20Graphic.pdfIFR_lost_comms_pdf
Malibuflyer
IFR lost coms procedures according to ICAO are also a little outdated.
I think this is very much an understatement!
I find it bizarre – if not an actual safety risk – that in the 21st Century Europe (unlike the whole of the USA) still have different procedures dependent on which territory one is overflying. If I have a Radio failure over Brussels en route from the U.K. to Germany (for me a frequent route) I have to comply with __Belgium __ regulations from their AIP – if I can find them in an emergency – rather than those from where I’ve come from, or those to where I am going.
Luckily, the advance of modern technology has overtaken the bureaucrats
As Peter says:
one should carry a handheld radio.
In fact, I believe they should be de riguer for IFR flying. I would likewise add that a mobile phone is also a life saver as this video demonstrates how the use of Texting saved the day:
Two tips:
Make sure both your handheld radio & your phone are fully charged. Likewise, have the facility to use them via your headphones (either by leads or Bluetooth) since the aircraft noise and/or the ability to hold them somewhere in the cockpit to get a good signal will be greatly reduced.
AIUI the procedure for lost comms in IFR on an IFR flight plan is to maintain any clearance you have been given for a period of 7mins then to rejoin your flight plan route until the IAF at your destination and then to hold there until your declared ETA before commencing the IAP and landing.
This applies if it is not possible to maintain and land VMC at the nearest suitable airfield.
Has this changed recently?
ATC will generally tell you that lost comms occurs quite often and in nearly all cases it is a jet flying out of range of the last unit. This is easily done, because under IFR you generally have no idea of the next unit’s frequency; they have to give it to you.
One can get a total electrical failure, even in a twin (the usual single point of failure there is the avionics master switch, in some old types) and for that one should carry a handheld radio.
A genuine long lasting lost comms situation, IFR, at altitude, is nowadays likely to get a lot of attention. Funny story above. So I think the procedure is a bit antiquated, and it is just as well it doesn’t get tested often…
Thread merged into a previous one.
IFR lost coms procedures according to ICAO are also a little outdated. They come from a time when the predominant reason for lost Coms has been a failed vacuum tube in the radio.
These days with solid state integrated Com/NAV/GPS-boxes in almost al airplanes practically flown under IFR, a lost communication (at least in Central Europe) in the majority of cases also include lost navigation as it is cost by failing entire boxes or total electric failure. In these situations it is typically also not possible to fly the filed flight plan.
Also the relevance of these procedures (again in Central Europe) is much lower as ATC has radar everywhere and therefore there is no need to guess where you are and in which direction you are heading to. As long as you do not do very surprising sharp turns…
Only having been in this situation once I have to admit that the lost comms procedures was the last thing I thought about…
boscomantico wrote:
I will be in VMC and able to somehow land maintaining VMC at a nearby airport with low traffic volume.
… this is exactly what I did and even if it would not be the regulation I would not feel bad about it. With a major problem in the plane, who would be so mad to enter IMC if one is in VMC and could stay there until after landing?
I had it once. Unable to transmit clicking worked to acknowledge clearances. Squawked 7600 clicked my route according flight plan to destination ATC was very helpful even the other FIR radar sector played there part..
Thanks Boscomantico, much appreciated!
Don’t know why the AIP didn’t occur to me, I know it’s there for the airports but didn’t think about the ENR section.
I found it in ENR 1.3 in the Swedish AIP, they clearly state that they reference ICAO Doc 4444 Chapter 15 too.
This is not regulated by EASA. There are standards set out by ICAO, but some countries operate differences from that. In Germany, the procedure is deep in GEN3.4 of the AIP, and I guess that is true also for other countries.
Moreover, even single airports have individual lost comm procedures, also written in the AIP. I don‘t even try to read or memorize all that. I have resorted that should I ever have a full blown radio failure, I will do what I think is safest in that moment. In all likelihood, I will be in VMC and able to somehow land maintaining VMC at a nearby airport with low traffic volume. If in IMC or there is widespread IFR conditions below, I will very likely (depending on circumstances) not continue all the way to the original destination, but choose a reasonable low-traffic volume IFR airport nearby and fly a standard approach. That happens to be pretty much what the German regulation says.
