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The EIR - beginning to end

Great! LSZK?

LSZH(work) LSZF (GA base), Switzerland

Bosco: when will a DME be no longer necessary for IFR certification? Our club bought an Archer III from the US with glass but no DME – in the US it was IFR certified but here it isn’t – due to missing DME…. everything else is there…… Due to people wishing to fly it IFR we were thinking of biting the bullet and paying the money to have a DME fitted but if shortly this is no longer necessary, that would be good news…..

EDL*, Germany

EU regulation 800/2013, in particular part NCO will go into effect in August 2016 in Germany.

Mainz (EDFZ) & Egelsbach (EDFE), Germany

Last time I flew there (a few years ago) I did not see any sids/stars other than RNAV ones. But you are right – just looked – there are some.

Then you must have overlooked lots of SIDs – but granted with over 100 pages it’s hard to see the forest for the trees.

Most SIDs are still classic navigation SIDs, and have been for decades. Then there are BRNAV SIDs – so even your KLN94 should be fine with them provided you also have a VOR and DME receiver. PRNAV SIDs are a relatively recent addition. I’ve never got anything other than classic SIDs (but I haven’t specifically asked for an RNAV SID…)

LSZK, Switzerland

Bosco: when will a DME be no longer necessary for IFR certification? Our club bought an Archer III from the US with glass but no DME – in the US it was IFR certified but here it isn’t – due to missing DME…. everything else is there…… Due to people wishing to fly it IFR we were thinking of biting the bullet and paying the money to have a DME fitted but if shortly this is no longer necessary, that would be good news…..

Note that Bosco said “strictly required”. There could still be an airspace requirements for DME and AFAIK, Germany has such a requirement.

Sweden has the weird arrangement that DME is required only above FL95, but at those levels RNAV is also required! I could understand that a DME could not be replaced by RNAV for approach work, just as you can’t replace an NDB with RNAV, but above FL95 it’s all enroute, so what’s the possible use of DME when you have RNAV…?

ESKC (Uppsala/Sundbro), Sweden

but above FL95 it’s all enroute, so what’s the possible use of DME when you have RNAV…?

Funnily enough – for position reporting of VFR flights. Especially in Spain, controllers want you to report something like XX miles on the XYZ radial of ZZZ VOR while en route. I have used that in other countries as well and the controllers were always happy with it. I never quite figured out why they would want that even in a radar environment (e.g. near Seville where you most definitely are in radar contact) but hey, better keep ’em happy.

They want to sleep…

Mainz (EDFZ) & Egelsbach (EDFE), Germany

Usefulness of EIR with adjacent control zone

The limitation of the usefulness of the Enroute Instrument Rating EIR in Germany with practically no IFR in uncontrolled airspace (the legality of this with respect to SERA being yet another discussion) and the MRVA usually no less than 500 ft above the lower end of controlled airspace have been discussed here already.

How about VFR aeorodromes with an adjacent control zone? The scenario I’m thinking about is my home base EDLE, with the EDDL control zone directly south west and a layer of class C starting 100 ft. above pattern altitude.

The class C above doesn’t seem to be helpful, but could I not, with an E-IR, take off in EDLE under any conditions that permit VFR flight in G, get a clearance (possibly even on the ground before departure?) to, say, fly a straight-out departure from rwy 25 to enter the CTR (S-VFR, if neccessary) for an IFR pick up for the enroute section and climb above 2500 into class C?

Seems to me like a much improved dispatch rate?

I don’t know how happily ATC would accomodate this, but for the sake of the argument, I’m just trying to figure out if this a viable option within the framework of the prevailing rules.

Hungriger Wolf (EDHF), Germany

What’s the advantage over avoiding the CTR?

Mainz (EDFZ) & Egelsbach (EDFE), Germany

What’s the advantage over avoiding the CTR?

How else can I legally fly VFR to an IFR pick-up point, for example with a ceiling of 2000 agl (elevation EDLE is 424 ft)?

I could reach the pattern altitude of 1400 msl in VMC. Class C starts in 1500 msl – which I could not legally enter VFR because I need a vertical distance to cloud of 1000 ft. IFR pick-up is only possible from .. 2000 ft msl in this case (the MRVA), if I understand this correctly? So there is an impenetrable 500 ft thick wall of regulations that prevent me from performing the flight rule change.

The CTR I could legally enter as a VFR flight and… perform the VFR/IFR change right there, before climbing through the IMC layer?

Hungriger Wolf (EDHF), Germany
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