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Suggestions for Eastern Europe (and flight plan filing)

If you file using independent tools like SD or directly to AFTN, the flight plan will be sent to exactly the addresses you (or the tool) specify.

Of course, but the possibility to do additional addressing to your liking was not the subject here.

But AIP-France does say that the flight plan should be sent to other places as well, beside the BRIA, including the tower of the destination airport.

ENR 1.11 specifies where the flightplan messages are ultimately distributed to. And of course that includes the departure ATSU.
What the Pilot is supposed to do though is in ENR 1.10. Only the BRIA/BNIA. And SD/EuroFPL conform to that.

Frankfurt (EDFZ, EDFE), Germany

Airborne_Again wrote:

Or they retain it for quality control since many VFR pilots don’t know how to file a correct flight plan. Sweden does, and it is not a country known for “job protection”.

Or to cover the quality of their notams or airspace management problems

ESSEX, United Kingdom

boscomantico wrote:

ENR 1.11 specifies where the flightplan messages are ultimately distributed to. And of course that includes the departure ATSU.
What the Pilot is supposed to do though is in ENR 1.10. Only the BRIA/BNIA. And SD/EuroFPL conform to that.

As far as I can see, AIP ENR 1.10.2 “Methods of communication of the flight plan” doesn’t make any mention of filing VFR flight plans over AFTN.

On the on the other hand, ENR 1.10.3 “Writing the flight plan” states (in 1.10.3.1.3): "Addresses to be indicated in the “addressees” field of the form 1.10.3.1.1 above are available in the section ENR 1.11."

I don’t doubt that what you say is what the French ARO wants, but I can’t find any info about it in the AIP. So EuroFPL must have been asked directly by the French ARO to only send flight plans to them.

ESKC (Uppsala/Sundbro), Sweden

but I can’t find any info about it in the AIP.

It‘s here (in ENR 1.10)

In any case, it would defy the purpose of having that „checking instance“ in between (the Bordeaux BRIA, in the French case) if pilots sent flightplans simultaneously also to the ultimatenrecipients, no?

Therefore, this is way it must be done (anywhere except the UK): send the FPL to the nominated ARO and let them do the checking and distribution.

Last Edited by boscomantico at 28 Aug 13:29
Frankfurt (EDFZ, EDFE), Germany

Glad I’ve kickstarted some discussion!

Departed Vodochody this morning for Tököl LHTL (thanks boscomantico!).

Landing, 43 hours parking and takeoff at Vodochody LKVO came to 2,182.84CZK / €84.35 which wasn’t too bad. Fuel was €2.23/litre for Avgas. Had a good chat with some of the Aero staff – they’re the company who make the jets the Breitling display team use which is cool! They even changed our remaining Czk into Euros for us. Talk about above and beyond.

Also, they have a great coffee machine in their cabin. Definitely go and use it.

The airspace through Slovakia is a little more involved but actually turned out to be super easy. Handover from Praha Information to Stefanik Radar consisted of “maintain 6,000”. Slowly starting to come round to the much less cluttered style of radio comms in this bit of Europe.

We were asked once to come slightly off track, then back to our flight plan and Tököl was an easy straight in after dodging a helicopter.

The town of Brno that we passed. Still no idea how to pronounce it. Sounded like “romeo” on the ATIS.

Picked up a few extra knots for free from the thermals en-route. Shame about the headwind.



Landing at Tököl. The displaced runway is basically impossible to spot – white markings on a white runway aren’t the one. Fortunately someone’s laid out some traffic cones. The runway is in fact 1,400m, not the 799m that are published. Go figure.

The taxiway (G1) that they send you down after landing on 14 does end. It just looks like it goes on forever.

Parking in the somewhat interesting looking hangar is only €13/night (roughly). Landing fees are somewhere in the same ballpark. Avgas 666 forint/litre.

The guy on the fuel pump/handling/etc was super. Didn’t say a lot but he was super gentle with our aircraft and sorted us out a big bucket of water to wash the flies off which was great. It sounds really stupid but when touring one of the hardest things to do is to find a way to wash your aeroplane (hey, guess what, no liquids allowed at the big airports!).

To be continued…

Last Edited by LawrenceDudley at 28 Aug 17:56
United Kingdom

boscomantico wrote:

It‘s here (in ENR 1.10)

(iii) is about IFR and (iv) doesn’t make any mention of AFTN – only telephone.

ESKC (Uppsala/Sundbro), Sweden

But „phoning the ARO“ clearly means that the flightplan shall go only to that ONE single agency! (I was not talking about how a flightplan shall be filed. Only about where it shall be sent to).

And, now going away again from what is written in the AIP, very clearly Bordeaux ARO DOES accept FPL sent directly to them to LFYNZPX, as show hundreds of FPLs filed succesfully via SD/EuroFPL.

Frankfurt (EDFZ, EDFE), Germany

Yeah I’m fairly sure I’ve filed in Europe with a few minutes prior to departure. Definitely did that in the Netherlands, no stress. Took 5 mins or so to come through.

United Kingdom

If you file electronically and (as with all electronic filing services AFAIK) the FP goes to the two towers (as well as other places, per AIP) then nobody can prevent the departure tower getting a copy.

The exception would be if the airport is too small to be on the AFTN, and then the address goes to a nearby big one. For example FPs addressed to LEAX (a sleepy dump) go to LEMG (Malaga). Another likely exception is the French Olivia which I am told isn’t “electronic” and there is a “little man” sitting there, manually re-typing all the FPs.

And once the tower sees a copy, they will let you depart. Somebody somewhere else might not like something on it, but it will be too late by then.

I don’t know how Netherlands manages to block people departing. Perhaps they have issued a standing order to all airports to ignore all FPs unless originating at their national briefing office…

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

We’re going to go to Tivat next – Tököl feels very no customs and Tivat sounds like it has no avgas so planning to go via Dubrovnik for a topup and customs.

Is the above vaguely true?

Also, has anyone been to Pescara or Ajaccio?

Seems like a logical start to the journey home.

United Kingdom
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