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Albenga and Samedan as a finale to 2019

Peter wrote:

I wish I had the chance to do more winter flying to the Alps, but I hope to address that soon.

upgrading to a TBM? :-)

LFHN - Bellegarde - Vouvray France

Albenga/Alassio is nice all year around. Actually, as all seaside places in the Med, it should rather be avoided in summer (July and August). Temps rarely are lower than 14 degrees in winter.

Fees: 80 at Albenga, 230 in Samedan.
Avgas was approx. 2.40 in both places.

In the north and middle of Italy, there are actually loads of places that regularly sell Avgas. It‘s merely south of Rome that it gets a bit less available.

Mainz (EDFZ) & Egelsbach (EDFE), Germany

Very nice trip bosco, and what a nice weather for flying! I’m jealous! I was also in the Alps at that time. Overall great weather, but most ski areas were totally overcrowded (as expected).

The approach into Samedan seems not to be a big deal, is it? I find it quite interesting that every FI, even if you never fly into mountainous terrain, doesn’t have to make any familiarization flight at LSZS. And now, even all pilots are free to come into LSZS without a familiarization flight, but are forced to make one, before they go? Strange policy. Nonetheless, the fees alone would prevent many of us from coming. 230 Swiss Francs (or Euros?) for one landing and few hours parking sounded like a bad joke.

Last Edited by Frans at 10 Jan 00:57
Switzerland

Hi Frans,

Frans wrote:

what a nice weather for flying!

Yes, in most of central Europe, it was very clear and VFR from the 28th of December all the way to 2nd January. It seems that many pilots generally discount the idea of undertaking a small trip between these holidays, thinking the weather WILL be bad. But that’s not always the case. I have been doing a trip after Chrismas for the last 5 years, and in most cases, it would have been well feasible even if it had had to be VFR.

The approach into Samedan seems not to be a big deal, is it?

In the right conditions, no of course it isn’t. But with unfriendly winds, it could be more challenging. Generally, in winter, departures will be less problematic due to better performance. But in sommer, in a loaded 172, it could be different. It also depends a bit on runway in use, and on how well you pick your arrival and departure strategies. But here, we are already talking about skill/knowledge, which many flatland pilots don’t have.

I find it quite interesting that every FI, even if you never fly into mountainous terrain, doesn’t have to make any familiarization flight at LSZS.

Yes.

And now, even all pilots are free to come into LSZS without a familiarization flight, but are forced to make one, before they go?

That’s what they say. Possibly to give some work to local flight instructors. Possibly to make logisitics easier for pilots seeking such familiarization, who would otherwise have to collect an (LSZS current) instructor from somewhere, fly him to LSZS, and then back again to his base.

With these regulations, it just doesn’t make sense to ask yourself about the sense they make.

Nonetheless, the fees alone would prevent many of us from coming. 230 Swiss Francs (or Euros?) for one landing and few hours parking sounded like a bad joke.

230 Euros, yes. Not really bad joke though. It’s one of the most exclusive places in the Alps in winter. Landing at Courchevel costs about the same. Many airline airports won’t even allow GA to land/park there in winter.

I treat it as a nice one-off experience that was worth it.

Last Edited by boscomantico at 10 Jan 10:51
Mainz (EDFZ) & Egelsbach (EDFE), Germany

boscomantico wrote:

In the right conditions, no of course it isn’t. But with unfriendly winds, it could be more challenging. Generally, in winter, departures will be less problematic due to better performance. But in sommer, in a loaded 172, it could be different. It also depends a bit on runway in use, and on how well you pick your arrival and departure strategies. But here, we are already talking about skill/knowledge, which many flatland pilots don’t have.
Thanks for your assessment. Makes sense. Perhaps I’ll give it a try this summer, when prices are a bit more accommodating.

boscomantico wrote:
230 Euros, yes. Not really bad joke though. It’s one of the most exclusive places in the Alps in winter.
Sure it is! A ski pass costs also over 100 Swiss Francs for just one day at St. Moritz during the holidays. Simply unbelievable. Even Zermatt is cheaper and offers with Cervinia and Valtournenche a lot more slopes than St. Moritz.

Besides a fantastic one-off experience, for which I would pay also 230 euros, those high fees make Samedan (at least during winter) not really usable for average GA. Besides Buochs on weekends, there is not a single airport more expensive for (small) GA in Switzerland, I guess. The next alternative airfields in the region would be LSZE or LILO. Quite far away.
Last Edited by Frans at 10 Jan 15:31
Switzerland

A Zermatt ski pass was about €300 for 6 days, 1 year ago. €100/day is pretty steep, no pun intended However, like Zermatt, one just “has to do it”, once…

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

My experience skiing at St Moritz involved a free apartment across the street from the Coop supermarket, a train from Rome and a bus from where the train terminated somewhere near Chiavenna. My main memory is of crowded slopes and many ski jackets with ‘Russia’ in large letters on them… this was at least 12 years ago. Sounds like I got off easy, cost wise!

I’ve stayed at the Allegra in Pontresina several times, closer to the airport I think, the now retired owners were friends of our motorcycling group. I’d recommend it, a wonderful place in summer with cheap auto fuel not too far away in Livigno

Thanks for the trip report, the photos looking up Maloja pass and over the Engadin lakes are particularly interesting to me having been through there many times.

Last Edited by Silvaire at 10 Jan 17:00

boscomantico wrote:

With these regulations, it just doesn’t make sense to ask yourself about the sense they make.

And that is the quote of the month !! Good one, @Bosco!

Great stuff! These posts inspire me to keep going through my maintenance misery and expense in the hope of doing similar trips in the not too distant future.

EIMH, Ireland

Frans wrote:

Besides a fantastic one-off experience, for which I would pay also 230 euros, those high fees make Samedan (at least during winter) not really usable for average GA.

Correct. Samedan has lost most of it’s small GA and lots of us are very angry about the outright outpricing of GA up there. In Summer it is slightly better as there is no snow fee, but still, I only go there when someone else pays the bill. For me, it is brutally clear that they do not want small GA but rather only Biz jets. That is unacceptable but unfortunately there is still no way to fight such exorbitant charges.

Needs to be said that the FOCA resisted approving even higher landing fees, which is the only thing they have authority to deny, otherwise landing fees were even higher. Unfortunately, that does not stop them imposing other fees which make the general experience simply unaffordable.

As for skiing, I have not been skiing in such exorbitantly expensive places since ski passes have gone through the roof. Last time I did, we went to Austria and Germany. It is a pity, I was a over 30 year regular in Arosa but I can’t afford those prices, particularly not for a family of 3. Clearly, it is a market economy thing that as long as people are willing to pay for this, they will continue to have it. Unfortunately this means lots of people in Switzerland can’t afford to go ski anymore or have to resort to resorts in the surrounding countries.

Last Edited by Mooney_Driver at 11 Jan 12:05
LSZH(work) LSZF (GA base), Switzerland
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