Good morning
First of all thanks for this forum, I’ve been reading for quite a while. I’m a FAA CPL/IR and I am trying to get my head around how IFR flying in the UK works. I’ve been reading about this topic for days but some questions are still on my mind.
Obviously there are lots of airports in class G airspace with instrument procedures. However, I found that most have an ATZ around the field and on the approach plate is a tower frequency (examples are Biggin Hill, Shoreham, Lydd, etc.). I am wondering if there are any official IFR approaches to airfields with an ATZ but without a tower. And if there are none: A tower in an ATZ does not clear IFR aircraft into CAS (afaik). Is the tower there only for spacing on the runway/within the circuit? Does the tower have any responsibility to seperate IFR flights (but planes wouldn’t have to use the service since in class G there is no official seperation of IFR/IFR)?
Thanks for the help.
Cheers
Florian
In G it is every pilot’s responsibility to officially keep a safe separation between themselves and any other aircraft, it doesn’t matter if the tower is manned or not. At an unmanned airfield it is also every pilots responsibility to make sure the runway is suited for landing. The only way to do that is to fly a low approach while looking at the runway, or at least have visibility enough to see the entire runway and then some, when you know the runway itself is OK. How are you going to do that flying IFR?
LeSving wrote:
How are you going to do that flying IFR?
Circle to land is an IFR manoeuvre :-)
LFHNflightstudent wrote:
Circle to land is an IFR manoeuvre :-)
I know a visual approach is an “IFR maneuver”, but I though a visual approach cannot be done without a clearance. You won’t receive a clearance in G, much less when there is no one in the tower.
If you fly into Varga (EKVG) on the Faroe Islands, you fly in uncontrolled G airspace all the way to the runway. There is someone in the tower giving you information on other aircraft and where they are positioned based on their positioning report (no radar environment there), but there is no clearance as they are not in the position to clear.
I have here my approach of earlier this year during the solar eclipse and I haven’t listened to the whole 10 min video again, but I think the “controller” is not clearing aircraft for landing even though I hear one aircraft captain responding with “cleared to land”. Video:
Thanks! That’s pretty much what I needed: To know how it actually works in the real world. So the only thing the tower does, is to tell everybody about the traffic that’s known to him. Pretty much as if everybody was VFR. (Of course see-and-avoid is the responsibility of any airplane in VMC)
Yes, but there are not too many airports in Europe with an instrument approach in G airspace and in most cases there will be a radar environment so you would be in contact with a radar/approach controller from e.g. a larger airport nearby or area controller that will clear you for the approach and then only the landing clearance is given by the tower controller (on a controlled airport that is).
Many in the UK…
LeSving wrote:
I know a visual approach is an “IFR maneuver”, but I though a visual approach cannot be done without a clearance. You won’t receive a clearance in G, much less when there is no one in the tower.
Well, you can. Towered airports in class G are possible but not common. In Europe, I don’t think you’ll find them anywhere except in the UK. If you read the Rules of the Air (both ICAO Annex 2 and SERA) you will find that aircraft are subject to clearances if they are flying in an airspace that requires a clearance or if they are “aerodrome traffic at controlled aerodromes.”. This last case applies regardless of airspace class.
SERA defines “Aerodrome traffic” in this way: all traffic on the manoeuvring area of an aerodrome and all aircraft flying in the vicinity of an aerodrome. An aircraft operating in the vicinity of an aerodrome includes but is not limited to aircraft entering or leaving an aerodrome traffic circuit;
As you can see “vicinity” is very loosely defined, so I guess that the purpose of the UK ATZs is to make precise what “vicinity” means.
I don’t know to what extent ATC for a towered airport in class G airspace is required to separate aerodrome traffic.
ArcticChiller wrote:
So the only thing the tower does, is to tell everybody about the traffic that’s known to him.
Careful with the terminology. A “tower” can both be a building and a function. As a function, a tower is an Air Traffic Control unit and does control traffic around the airport (at least). On an uncontrolled airport, there would be no tower function in the tower building but if it was manned there would be an Air/Ground operator (A/G) or an Aerodrome Traffic Information Service (AFIS) operator. In the case of Vagar, it is AFIS.
