What is going on: 2000 172SP $249,000

For an aeroclub or flight school the answer will absolutely be YES. The market for Cessnas is big but I admit that these prices are very high.

From following some USA centric forums the demand for 172’s has gone up and the market is starting to reflect it (not many available).
For Cirrus on the other hand more planes are available used. Many Cirrus owners can easily afford the plane in the first place and upgrade to the newest model every year = depreciation. The rawdata between a 10 year old and a 1 year old SR22 is very similar… the rest is paint and gadgets.

I think you could ask the same question on base prices as well: the base price for a C172SP with glass cockpit and new gadgets is 350-400k$ and 450-500k$ for C182 if you pick them new from Kansas, so they are not that far from new Cirrus SR22 G2/G3 base prices

I expect C172s/182s to hold their values much more that SR22 G2/G3 for reasons Snoopy mentioned, but any aircraft with 500h left TBO may need a 10% discount

the base price for a C172SP with glass cockpit and new gadgets is 350-400k$

Just btw, the SP designation has been dropped by Cessna many years ago.

Also, all 172s have been glass (G1000) since the end of 2005. No more six pack option. So we are talking 13 years.

I think this is one reason why these 1998-2005 172s are relatively sought after. Many clubs and schools with a 172 fleet still like to split it between glass and traditional instrumentation to some degree (especially some renters prefer the six-pack I assume). So, we are looking at maybe less than 4000 examples wordwide, of restart 172s with six-pack, that are so highly sought after.

On the other hand, I would think twice before considering one of those 2005-2008 glass Skyhawks (lots of them built in that period), as they have the non-WAAS G1000 and the dreaded KAP140 AP. Upgrading that is either impossible or a financial nightmare. With a six-pack 172, stick in a GTN, a G5 and a GFC500 (which is straightforward and with “relatively” small financial pain), and you are 100% up to today’s avionics standards. Market prices (of the 2006 to 2008 ones) don’t seem to reflect this much though, probably since many prospective buyers don’t really know these details, and the chance to have a “full-glass” airplane for 250k is still so enticing..

boscomantico wrote:

dreaded KAP140 AP.

Bosco, you are exaggerating here

As for WAAS completely right.
All in all, being tied up to G1000, is not exactly the best thing for the next decades.

@pmh
The early Cirrus SR22 are a can of worms regarding quality problems.
I would always prefer a C172/182 as a reliable and durable a/c.

https://www.cirruspilots.org/copa/non_member/guest_discussion/f/11/t/32501.aspx

What exactly is the problem with the KAP140 in these airplanes? Apart from the fact that they lack the FD system of the KFC150 or 200, it appears they have quite some functionality in the version I see used in that airplane.

I agree, the G1000 non WAAS is a big gotcha for those who think Glass=modern. Generally I consider the G1000 a big liability for owners as you are totally dependent on Garmin and their outrageous pricing for some stuff with the G1000 in your airplane. Unfortunately quite a lot of new airplanes today are only delivered with the G1000 and have no option for other systems.

As for the early Cirri, I reckon most of these quality issues should have been addressed in the last 15 years? I can not really imagine that a 2004 plane which got delivered as the one described in the quote still fly with all these deficiencies? Nevertheless, this also shows that there were massive problems in the early days and behaviour of sales staff which showed just what market power they had in those days. I hope they have changed that by now.

My experience of trying to give some 200k+ to the UK Cirrus dealer for an SR20 in 2002 was similar to the above (“you don’t need a DME; a GPS is much better, and I have a real customer over there I would rather talk to” kind of attitude) so I went to Socata and never regretted it.

However I suspect a C172 for $250k is one of these and we see large numbers of such examples. You get the same in the housing market, in nice areas

The C172 is a very nice and forgiving aircraft, which many know from their training. So, demand is high and available machines are comparably few. Rising prices under such conditions was called ‘market’ in the old days ;-). Especially the C172SP is highly asked for, as it does not have the glass cockpit tied to the TC. If you don’t want G1000, with all the quirks of being hard married to Garmin, but like to get your cockpit to your linking with modern avionics, the old steam gauge aircraft are a far better choice.

Yes, there will come a time where older SR will hold similar value, i.e. when the current crowd of Aquila & Co trained enter the buyers market. We have to see what will be left of GA once that happens.