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What percentage of IAPs have you flown to minima, in non-training conditions?

Picking up from that CAT2 thread, this seems a reasonable question.

I think that for Cat 1 (private IR) pilots, the figure must be in the single-figure area, or lower. I recall maybe five in 8-9 years. One was an ILS to Biggin.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

ZERO

I am not good enough to do that alone. 700 or 800 ft was the lowest, traveling alone or with family. In training with my Lufthansa FI I did some down to CAT 4 ;-)

One!

ESKC (Uppsala/Sundbro), Sweden

First approach I ever did on my own in IMC went to minimums. It was a non precision LOC approach down to 602ft into Hawthorne here in Los Angeles. Not sure that was the best thing to start my IFR career with, but might as well pop the cherry first thing. I remember thinking after FAF how long it took at MDA before the rwy came into sight. Felt like an eternity, and I almost thought I’d have to go missed.

In non practise situations, only three:

1) ILS EBOS Oostend/Belgium. The weather was much worse than expected, ATIS gave 400ft AGL but it was exactly at 200ft where I saw the light. Would not fly there if I knew that was the weather due to lack of currency but once on the ILS

2) VOR to Iraklion, Greece, 400ft AGL. That was a great example where a Cessna is more capable than an airliner because I did a dive and drive until the threshold and only then saw the light (they are of ridiculous quality there) and was able to descent from that position. Airliner in front of me had to go around.

3) RNAV to Straubing EDMS, all the time due to the Danube and my arriving in the morning usually. I get the feeling that a lot of pilots at EDMS bust the minimums by a large margin… Last time I did that approach, Jason was enjoying an extended holding because I like to do such things at 100 KTAS or less

Last Edited by achimha at 11 Jan 08:59

I’ve only had to go missed for real five times although I’ve broken out very close to minima quite often. I follow Timothy’s practice and fly every instrument approach as if it is to minima so it’s not really that much harder when you do it for real.

FWIW, four of the five have been at Biggin where the slightly higher elevation can make it susceptible to low cloud / fog in the morning.

EGSC

I have done quite a few as I fly year round so it comes with the territory. I always make sure I have plenty of fuel and a good practical alternate if I can’t get it.

I am not good enough to do that alone. 700 or 800 ft was the lowest, traveling alone or with family. In training with my Lufthansa FI I did some down to CAT 4 ;-)

I am interested by this quote. As an instrument rated pilot what aspect of the final 5-600ft concerns you? At the point where you become visual or go missed are you stable? Assuming you are stable, I personally believe it is safer to continue to the minima than go around (we are talking an approach in actual IMC).

It is fine to not plan to do an approach to minima (so called personal minima) but any IR pilot should be able to fly one safely.

Last time I did that approach, Jason was enjoying an extended holding because I like to do such things at 100 KTAS or less

Ha yes I remember. My longest ever hold anywhere. It felt like you were flying at a lot less than 100kts!

I have had one at Biggin as well (actually twice the same day). Oxford also several times.

Last Edited by JasonC at 11 Jan 09:07
EGTK Oxford

In the 34 yrs of IFR flying I cant count how many times I went to minimums both precision and non. Being based at KHTO and flying to and from the Cape islands as well as other parts of the East Coast meant that there were a lot of VLIFR approaches. I added the V in LIFR. So dont try and look it up.

My instructor as part of my IR training would have me land under the hood. His philosophy was that if ever I got into a situation where I needed to land the first time it should not be under an emergency condition. That way at least I knew I could do it and so would be better able to fly and land in such a case.

That included spin training.

Now they dont even give spin training in the US for any rating! Well I take that back they must still teach spin training to get your glider rating. I hope.

Thats why I dont believe in personal minimums. If your not comfortable going to minimums get more training till you are.

KHTO, LHTL

I did 2 on my initial IR training (serendipity with the weather). Since then, 3 in light aircraft. None of those 3 were planned but the weather just deteriorated.

London area

I follow Timothy’s practice and fly every instrument approach as if it is to minima

One guy who I recall saying he flies every one to minima was actually referring to a multi pilot operation (not necessarily a multi pilot aircraft).

Then it makes perfect sense.

If you fly every one to 200ft or whatever, single pilot, and only then look up, one could debate whether that is the safest thing to do. The “for” argument is that you are getting some extra practice for when you will need it. The “against” argument is that since very few approaches are to minima (or anywhere near) you are greatly reducing safety on those flights.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom
26 Posts
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