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When to say NO to maintenance

A really good article from US AOPA here

Somebody’s Annual quote included the following:

$200 for cleaning injection nozzles – totally pointless
$300 for replacing o-ring seals in brake calipers – is fine to do on condition
$1700 4-year magneto overhaul – inspection/repair is fine
$400 for magneto pressurisation filter – pointless (easily inspected, and that’s a “French price” for a filter!)
$800 for replacing a $395 Gill battery – pointless (if load test is passed) and a ripoff (the shop doubled the retail price)
$320 for replacing a TKS filter – pointless (easily inspected)

This is one reason I am on the N-reg. These items tend to be lifed on Euro-regs.

Actually this customer had a “slightly big plane” (not sure what, but TKS, pressurised mags suggest FL250 so a turbo) and the Annual parts list on my TB20 is a fraction of the above. But there is other stuff e.g. the emergency gear release valve (easy to check functionally and no unsafe failure mode).

The Big Problem is that to do the above the owner needs to get seriously involved, and most don’t want to. A lot of people in the USA use the article author (Mike Busch, Savvy Maintenance) to manage their maintenance, and one can even do that with a UK-based aircraft (remotely) although I am sure many maintenance companies would not want to deal with that. One Part 145 (FAA+EASA) company told me they would not do this because they need the profit on the supply (dealer discount) of the various lifed parts. But if you are N-reg you don’t need a company. You just need a freelance A&P/IA and a hangar where he can work.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

This is one reason I am on the N-reg. These items tend to be lifed on Euro-regs.

I don’t think so. The 400h magneto “overhaul” is required but that is a simple field job by somebody who has received magneto training. Takes 30 minutes, I’ve done it myself with an A&P. Not expensive, just a few small replacement parts. Batteries, brake o-rings, injection nozzle cleaning are definitely not timed items. TKS filter and magneto filter I don’t know but never heard that they are.

My aircraft has very few expensive lifed parts. The vaccuum pump, fuel pump and turbocharger oil valves come to mind. From that perspective, N-reg would hardly make a difference.

Looks like this was a Turbo Cirrus. It’s a typical list for that type.

The Cirrus is a bit special here; it tends to have a lot of items with TBOs attached to it. I attribute this to the fact that it’s still – comparatively speaking – a new design (type certified in ~ 2000).

Other “golden age” contenders have been certified in the 50s and 60s and it looks like liability issues and money grabbing were not yet that prominent at the time.

Diamonds, CessnaTTx, Tecnams etc. are very similar to the Cirrus in this regard.

So yes, if you are Euro-reg., having one of those old heaps can be an advantage (but then you get bitten by SIDs etc.).

Regarding managing the maintenance: it’s not that difficult as Peter suggests. For getting “involved” with maintenance (i.e. knowing what is effectively required and what not), it is sufficient to study the manual and go through it with your mechanic once or twice. Read a bit on the type club forum and you get the picture. Most owners do at least that.

I am not a very “technical” person for sure. Still I think I manage to manage the aircraft well, i.e. making it as safe as can be and still not waste any money.

Also, I thonk that most shops are much more cooperative with N-reg owners than Peter sugests. They know that most owners are so ewhat savvy nowadays and will not sign the famous bank cheque. For 15 years, I have been working with the biggest and oldest Cirrus shop in Europe and the cooperation is fantastic. No way will they ever do something just “because it’s in the maintenance manual”.

Mainz (EDFZ) & Egelsbach (EDFE), Germany

The 400h magneto “overhaul” is required but that is a simple field job by somebody who has received magneto training

Looking at how few shops here can do a D3000 single shaft dual mag without bodging it (wildly varying mag drops, etc) my attitude to risk for sure differs from yours I have a spare one on the shelf and use QAA in Tulsa, Oklahoma, to do them; nobody else.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

The 400h magneto “overhaul” is required but that is a simple field job by somebody who has received magneto training

I do not agree.

Their is a difference between a 500 hours and 4 year overhaul on TCM magneto’s (both single and dual). Have done quite a few of them, trained by a guy who only does aircraft magneto’s, starters and alternators for over 30 years.
The 500 hours inspection takes about 2 – 2,5 hours, overhaul would take 4-6 hours.

To do in my opinion a good job you would need to get the magneto of the engine (some do it with the magneto installed on the engine), have the right tools, and a test bench to check for proper operation. Anyone who take less than two hours on this job must be skipping items, and neglicting items. A common one that comes to might is capacitor checking (measuring). The last is especially true to dual magneto’s, where the capacitors stay at the harness end, and often stay with the aircraft.

Also, I thonk that most shops are much more cooperative with N-reg owners than Peter sugests.

I agree.

Last Edited by Jesse at 16 May 08:18
JP-Avionics
EHMZ

The Cirrus is a bit special here; it tends to have a lot of items with TBOs attached to it. I attribute this to the fact that it’s still – comparatively speaking – a new design (type certified in ~ 2000).

There is nothing special about the Cirrus.

The ONLY absolutely MANDATORY service and/or replacement items under FAA FAR Part 91 operations are listed in :

- The TCDS
- Chapter 4 of the MM
- By Airworthiness Directive

If the item is NOT listed in one of the above, then it can be treated “on condition”, period.

This is exactly the same for every other GA .

FAA A&P/IA
LFPN

Not that I know anything about the Cirrus…

But what I wanted to say is that the Cirrus (and AFAIK also the Diamonds, Cessna TTX etc) has a very long list of itmes with “recommended” TBOs (i.e. Not in chapter 4) and that legacy aircraft tend to have less such items.

Does an old Cessna have a 2-year recommended TBR on the fuel drain valves?

Mainz (EDFZ) & Egelsbach (EDFE), Germany

But what I wanted to say is that the Cirrus (and AFAIK also the Diamonds, Cessna TTX etc) has a very long list of itmes with “recommended” TBOs (i.e. Not in chapter 4) and that legacy aircraft tend to have less such items.

That is indeed true for the Cirrus, not so for the Lancair / Columbia /TTX , ask me how I know

Honestly, I have no frg’n idea why they would put a 2 year TBO on fuel drain …

FAA A&P/IA
LFPN

I think I’ll get a Howard DGA to go places… At least it would avoid all that nonsense and a 450 Pratt is not so expensive to maintain!

What’s happened to the option for ignoring lifed items, EASA-reg?

I have a vague memory of this blowing up with seat belts, some 5-10 years ago. Cessna, IIRC. It was especially controversial because they are trivially easy to visually inspect. Then some people in the maint trade posted on some UK forum that this is false and you don’t need to do it. It was something to do with proposing a custom maintenance programme to the UK CAA. Then I read something that this was possible in theory but in practice almost nobody succeeded.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom
21 Posts
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