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Are panel mounted avionics going to become obsolete?

ADF , can somebody verify that the ADF is at least useful as the "poor pilots stormscope " ?

LGGG

my iPhone lives in a holder on the windshield (suction cup on the left side, where the Cessna windshield has a flat area).

Sorry, but I have to say it. The glareshield, windshield or ANYTHING that is blocking the pilot’s view is not a good place for these things. Lookout is bad enough for collision avoidance, don’t make it worse! Stick it to your leg, centre console, yoke, sidewall, anywhere, please!

Biggin Hill

The ADF should have an AD issued against it to make it INOP. It is mandatory suicide to follow the in situ legislation rather than using ‘illegal’ GPS overlay. No pilot should be allow and may be considered liable if they intentionally use the least reliable navigation method on board.

The schools want to hold us to ransom (excuse pun) to make us fly a nav aid that doesn’t work.

Wait till a court case comes up:
Judge: were you aware the nav aid was unreliable?
Pilot: Yes
Judge: so why did you use it?
Pilot: CAA told me to..
Judge to CAA: why is this so?
CAA: because we’re government employees and don’t want change. Damn it was good enough for me in 1950 so who are you to question it!

Last Edited by DMEarc at 22 Aug 20:24

ADF , can somebody verify that the ADF is at least useful as the "poor pilots stormscope " ?

Only for lightning very close to you. Lightning signal levels on ADF frequencies (>500kHz) are too low.

LSZK, Switzerland

It was a hot day, probably 32 C inside the airplane at our altitude of 3000 MSL. It was also very clear. I don’t have the iPad mounted, but make an effort to keep it out of direct sunlight. This day, the pilot in the copilot seat was holding it and I really did not expect that it had direct sun light on it as the sun was mostly from directly overhead, We also had a portable ADS-B receiver we were testing and it is white and was left on the glareshield, but it did not get too hot. We had to turn the unit off for about 5 minutes and put it in the direct air stream of the overhead vent. Regardless, I use an iPad like I use a map or chart and it is only on when I am looking at the map or chart. I really can’t see using it for an MFD other than for short periods. When heat isn’t getting it down, running out of power is the next issue, as it is down to very low after a four hour flight if it is left on continuously. Plugging it in has its issues as even the slightest cock in the plug and external power is no longer keeping the battery up.

KUZA, United States

A month ago I had my iPad Air overheat as well. Had left it in the sun on the front seat for 5 mins. I can also echo the sentiment about power drain. On long (>5 hr) flights you have to watch out not to drain your battery completely. Works better at night btw, especially with JeppFD’s white-on-black night mode & you can turn the brightness way down.

I noticed this first on my iPhone (!) because it was running the VFR terminal area chart – the G1000 right in front of me showed the airspace blocks but not the height limits in the mode he was using it.

One point I’d like to make though – during a recent x/c over New Mexico, I did notice how the aircraft position on ForeFlight’s VFR sectional wasn’t completely matching the G1000 airspace depiction. The offset was somewhere around +- 0.5nm. On JeppFD’s IFR chart it showed me smack in the middle of the airway, so I reckon the GPS receiver precision was fine. There may be a slightly inexact mapping of the VFR sectional which I gather is done through a manual process, even in the US.

Reportedly, Ipads have already destroyed the aviation GPS sales in pilot shops, and I can partly understand that. The innovation in aviation handhelds has been appalling.

Agreed. As a general application platform, development can move directly from thought to implementation at full speed on the Ipad, unlike these closed source dedicated units. The functionality in applications like ForeFlight is just staggering.

Another point though – aesthetically speaking, I kinda like having a neat, compact, streamlined panel. A steam panel cluttered up with all sorts of portable devices on the yoke, windscreen, semi-empty spots on the panel, etc, makes the instrumentation a bit chaotic.

Some of the newer G2000/3000 glass cockpits are clearly designed with usability and human factors in mind, which I think does count for something in the cockpit.

Some of the newer G2000/3000 glass cockpits are clearly designed with usability and human factors in mind, which I think does count for something in the cockpit.

The market share of new aircraft in GA is in the low single digits so not very relevant on a larger scale. Also none of the integrated gear is available for retrofit. For the majority us pilots it’s avionics piecemeal and there, the tablets are a true revolution.

The only thing you really need a certified GPS for is to program the autopilot. Everything else you can do better on one or more tablets. If there is a way to conveniently transfer flight plans from tablets to certified GPS units, then it will be perfect.

Reportedly, Ipads have already destroyed the aviation GPS sales in pilot shops, and I can partly understand that.

I think there is nothing bad or deplorable about it, it’s great that these overpriced units have become superfluous and replaced by the much more powerful and innovative tablet software. Recently I was in a sleek certified French helicopter called Guimbal G2 and it had SkyDemon in the panel.

Are panel mounted avionics going to become obsolete?

No. But for VFR the standard nowadays (experimental and UL/LSA) is one or two “glass’es” and a pad of some kind + separate radio and transponder. The main benefit of these glass’es is ease of installation, weight, flexibility and price compared with a traditional setup that displays the same amount of information. The fact that these glasses complete suck at displaying main flight data (IAS, Alt and RPM/MAP) compared with classic instruments, seems to be a thing that nobody talks about. As engine monitoring devices, they are quite outstanding though.

These pad navigation apps does indeed show how things can be done. Still, a panel mount is a better solution. Eventually these apps also will end up being panel mounted.

The elephant is the circulation
ENVA ENOP ENMO, Norway

The only thing you really need a certified GPS for is to program the autopilot. Everything else you can do better on one or more tablets. If there is a way to conveniently transfer flight plans from tablets to certified GPS units, then it will be perfect.

Why not remove all the flight instruments and just hang on to a few iPads.

I don’t think I could be more in disagreement with the first sentence that is quoted.

The second sentence makes sense and there are now products on the market to accomplish this.

KUZA, United States

Of course you want an EFIS + backup in the panel. I’m talking about everything on top of that. I see a lot of value in a mechanical AI as backup, having turned off my Aspen yesterday in flight, gone into a steep turn and turned it on again. Not good…

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