Flying with small children onboard

You now have 60 hours TT, that is how much since your PPL Checkride? And how much have you been flying in the last say 1-2 months? You will need 3 landings in the last 3 months in order to take passengers, that you certainly know.

Personally I took my own family members within several hours past the PPL test which was at 36:29 hours and 197 landings. Just looked into my log and find those were fun times.
First flight post PPL check was the ferry flight of my just acquired airplane to homebase.
2nd flight was a short flight over my hometown with a friend
3rd flight was with my then girlfriend, followed by flights to several to neighboring airfields with her.
I took my mother, who was massively scared, at around 8 hours past the checkride and she ended up loving it.
First longer flight (LSZR-LFLY and back) was with roughly 60 hours TT, so basically where you are now. (3 hours each way, C150).

My GF at the time loved flying. She would probably have gone the way to the PPL sooner or later.

Why am I telling you this? Remember the German saying, “Es gibt nix gutes, es sei denn man tut es”(there is no good deed unless you do it).

I agree with LeSving that it might be an idea to take your wife alone first. Where I don’t agree at all is that you should teach her all the emergency and crash scenarios, if you do that, that first flight will never happen. Honestly, who does this when driving or taking a ride with a motorcycle (which I am scared of and won’t do) stating at first how to jump of in order not to be paralyzed for life? Passengers are usually scared before they gain confidence and to go through all the possible horrors will not help.

Your wife needs to gain confidence in your skills, which normally should happen rather quickly if she sees that flying an airplane is actually more relaxed than driving a car. What you have to brief her are the basic safty things in an airplane: how to open the door, to always walk from the airplane towards the back, never to the front (which is only important if the engine is running but a good thing to do as a general rule) and how to fasten/unfasten the seatbelts. That is about it for the start. Once she gains more confidence and starts to be interested, that is when you can start teaching her a few things or encourage her to maybe take a pinch-hitter course.

As for your kids, I am before that too. The 3 year old should not be a problem, the very small one needs someone to sit next to her. I also have mused about car seats e.t.c. but a friend who has two kids told me he is using a very light one to good effect. I got one of those as well but have not used it yet.

childrens headset for the 3 year old should work and a muffler for the 1.5 year old as well.

So by all means do some more flights with friends but when the chance arises, take your wife for a short flight, so she gets the idea what it is all about. Mostly anxieties will go away after a few routine flights if not earler and then she will also be comfortable taking the kids. Not unlike after your driving test really.

MedEwok wrote:

Now my questions (and initial thoughts in italic):

Honestly, I think you are overcomplicating this. That might even in itself scare off your wife. I’ve made many flights with people who’ve not been on board a light aircraft before and they generally love it.

I agree that you should fly with only your wife first and that you should avoid turbulence, if possible. But cancelling a flight on an otherwise good day just because there is a chance of light turbulence could get your wife worrying.

As you say, you must be able to isolate your kids on the intercom. My experience with having kids on board is that there’s no way of making them stop talking. They could even find that it’s fun hearing their own voice in the headset so they start yelling in the mike.

To add a datapoint, my 3 year old had ditched the aviation headset and was watching Netflix on a tablet with a pair of Bose QC35 within 10 minutes of departure. For all he cared he could have been in the car.

These inflatable car seats are pretty suitable in the Mooney so I guess the same goes for the 172: https://www.bubblebum.co/

I agree with most of what has already been said.

Taking your wife on her first trip and expecting her to mind two young children on that trip, is a recipe for never having her fly with you again.

Most passengers are a little nervous before flying. (In fact if you read the threads here and elsewhere, most pilots has a small dose of nerves before flying!)

This is especially true for first time passengers. I think it’s even more true for a close partner who knows all your faults and failings! (It can be easier to trust a stranger as being “highly trained”). Your wife will have lots of questions, she will want to know what’s happening, what that horn means, why we’re getting bumps, why did the engine suddenly change sound etc? Even simple things like ATC refusing a clearance to transit an airspace might seem like a major problem to them. Learning that none of these is a problem is reassuring and will build her confidence in further trips.

But now imagine that she has those thoughts, but can’t ask the questions because a) she’ s busy trying to control/entertain the kids and b) doesn’t want to ask something that might scare the kids. She’s just going to get more and more worried and you’ll land thinking “that went really well!” and she’ll say “I’m never flying with you again! That was way too scary!”

Take your wife flying a few times before taking the children. Then even consider taking one of the children first so you can, as a team, figure out how best to manage the two children in flight. For example it might mean that the 3 year old is quite comfortable and could easily sit in the front while your wife sits in the back with the 1 & 1/2 year old. But you could only find that out by taking the three your old without the 1 & 1/2 year old first and seeing how they get on.

Basically get your wife comfortable, before introducing the kids. Then she can help in figuring out what’s best in terms of the kids.

I’d definitely not try to teach your wife about landing or other emergencies (other than normal passenger briefing). She’ll most likely decide that there is far too much that can go wrong, and not want to fly. If she shows an interest, you can introduce that when she’s really gotten used to flying, but it’s certainly not something that I’d bring up!

dp

I just spoke to my wife about what we did.

We took a car seat in the back clipped seat belt through the back and that provided a comfortable, familiar and secure place for our one year old to sit. We only used hearing protectors as chance of a 1.5yo keeping mic in right place is low.I would put them all in the back if that is feasible but if your 3 year old can follow instructions and understand that you may not be able to talk to them at some points then maybe they can go up front. But your wife should certainly sit with the youngest

Teach your wife how to open the door. She will be too busy with kids to spot planes etc – forget about that. Take sick bags. I would fly higher, your youngest will usually fall asleep then.

And you are right to do a short first flight. If you can let them see your house (or think they do) all the better.

You should not overcomplicate it for a short first flight, everybody (wife+children) will have the stamina for a 20min local flight and if you are current you can do it “eyes closed” without much stress on you side

For longer trips, probably try some flights with your wife first, for childrens try and get their interest and curiosity with a “non-flying visit” to the airfield in a good day and promise to take them up another day…for childrens tablets/games should do when things get less excited in the back seats (all my back seating passengers tend sleeps after 30min cruise, the two seatting in the front get all the fun), for adults, I give SD tablets, maps, books to read in the back

Good luck with it, I had a lot of difficulties getting my wife confidence back to fly longer trips, so you may have to go slowly and always keep cool whatever happens !

Mooney_Driver wrote:

First flight post PPL check was the ferry flight of my just acquired airplane to homebase.

It’s funny reading the log book. My first flight was flying home from my check ride at ENKB. 1:15 cross country trip ENKB-ENVA. On the way to the check ride I flew with an instructor who lived at Kristiansund I don’t think I actually had my license, it came later in the mail, don’t remember exactly how we arranged that. My next flight was with my wife (now ex). She was 5 months pregnant with our first child at that time. At 58 h total time I had already taken aerobatic lessons, and were flying loops and rolls with the C-152A. Before 60 h total I had already taken my brother up for a spin (literally) in the 152A

I have never pushed anyone to come with me flying. I have 3 sons, and only one of them thought flying was cool. He came with me for several trips, and soloed at 17, after 10 hours instruction. He is now 18 and flies whenever he wants.

Airborne_Again wrote:

Honestly, I think you are overcomplicating this

That was essentially my first thought as well. Why make a problem out of it? If your wife don’t like flying, then forget all about going on a “nice family trip”. Problem solved. If she likes hit, then get her involved properly because she will become an essential part of the team. If she gets scared by that, then why bother with “family trips”? I just don’t see the point at all. Protect her from getting scared? That alone would mean a no go IMO. Either she is “cut out” to like flying, or she isn’t. Forcing her or shielding her will not help.

Like Jason, I asked my wife , who is also my “FO”. Her immediate reaction was “send her up with an instructor first”. Best if you know an experienced instructor who is used to giving “trial lessons” (i.e. pleasure flights), as he/she should be well versed in the tricks which give confidence to a nervous passenger.

Hope that helps, and good luck!