Did an AFIL with Lille Approach when on a VFR flightplan and being confronted with a band of low clouds in the way’ I asked and received IFR clearance without any struggle.
How many NM from your destination were you ?
About 15NM
I don’t think that is AFIL. That is just a “pop up IFR clearance” which has always been possible in most of Europe. In the UK it is generally possible into Class D and generally impossible into Class A.
AIUI, AFIL seems to be an “entitlement” to get airborne and dictate a route to ATC, who are supposed to generate a valid route and insert it into the system. I am damn sure it is totally unsupported in a lot of places, with the UK being at the top of the list.
In the old days, the ability to handle “pop up clearances” varied around Europe, because – I am told by ATC – ATC cannot just let somebody into the IFR system. They have to generate at least a fragment of an IFR route, across their sector and others nearby. And the ability to do this varies. The UK never – at the time – bought the extra software needed to do this. My entire route was once lost for Switzerland and France, and they created a new one, slightly different. But AFIL is supposed to formalise the capability.
Does that depends if pilot/ATC closes the AFIL FPL once the aircraft lands? I mean there is an FPL sitting somewhere not just one getting a clearance?
If you have an active VFR FPL and got caught in weather, ATC will not open a new IFR FPL one for you? they will just give an “IFR clearance” on their sector, say you cloud-break on their ILS before heading to nearby VFR destination
About 15NM
Then it is pretty straightforward to coordinate. One maybe two different atc sectors.
If you have an active VFR FPL and got caught in weather, ATC will not open a new IFR FPL one for you?
Your VFR FPL gets converted into an IFR current flight plan.
airways wrote:
Your VFR FPL gets converted into an IFR current flight plan.
How is that possible? VFR and IFR flight plans are handled in completely different ways. In most of Europe, enroute ATC wouldn’t even get a VFR flight plan.
Thanks @airways and for VFR without active Flight Plan asking for “pop up IFR clearance”, I am assuming ATC files an FPL IFR?
I had few cases where I was flying VFR no FPL, then request ILS to nearby big runway and departing SVFR or IFR to my uncontrolled home airfield or land in the big runway, once, when I asked for IFR departure to my homebase ATC reminded me that I will have to call them or just close the FPL myslef after I landed at my homebase, so I am assuming there was an IFR FPL logged somewhere?
Ps: in the UK we don’t have to close VFR FPLs
How is that possible?
You just pick up the phone and call the next sector/center.
I am assuming ATC files an FPL IFR?
No, we make a coordination by phone with the next sector. The next sector does the same with his next sector, etc…
Typically, you’ll get a clearance until the last agreeing sector’s boundary. Most of the time this works until your destination. Sometimes it doesn’t
and you’ll have to choose between cancelling IFR at the clearance limit, holding for XX time or diverting to somewhere else.
Big disclaimer: this works pretty well with slow GA, because we get some time to coordinate all of this. Please don’t try it with your CJ3+ and RFL390 :-)
Peter wrote:
AFIL seems to be an “entitlement” to get airborne and dictate a route to ATC, who are supposed to generate a valid route and insert it into the system.
Some people might read AFIL like this, but SERA clearly states differently. Also for Flightplans filed while in the air, it is the pilot or operator who files the plan, not ATC. It is therefore the responsibility of the pilot or operator to provide all information required for the flight plan, including providing a valid route. In SERA terms, AFIL doesn’t imply more than an ATC unit acting as a relay to transmit information that you would normally send by fax or in an online form.
More specifically, SERA does not include a single word on preferred treatment of such air filed flight plans. Therefore if we are taking about the “right” to airfile, from a legal POV the plan is subject to the same checks and rules as a ground filed plan – including rejection, slots, etc.
As in practice this would not work, the process is a very different one: The ATC unit where you AFIL coordinates with all following sectors so that they come up with a plan that is “automatically accepted”. Despite popular belief this is en extra service by ATC for which there is no legal basis and a fortiori one has no “right” that it is done.
Therefore asking nicely for a favor is the much better route for success as a pilot…
