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Four Seats / Light IFR duties

4 pax light IFR for me a good fit aircraft is

C182 P
230hp O 470
Mogas STC availible ( this can be a real cost saver if you run it on methanol free car fuel!!!!!!!)
130 KIAS
300ltr tanks
2 doors and good space inside
full windows that open
approx 500kg payload if you are on N reg youcan get a extra 150lbs STC
easy to fly
easy to insure at reasionable costs
easy to land and not much runway needed also grass no problem at all
you can find a very good example that will fit easy in your budget with all the required avionics Garmin 430, mode s, etc.
alloy so you can park it anywhere you want/can also for longer time
good and reasonable costs for spares and easy to get
easy to get good maintainance

fly2000

Buy the simplest, sturdiest, best useful load and youngest four seater. In terms of availability this is likely to be a Warrior ii. The Archer is more powerful, by 20HP, but Warrior’s hold their value. The 180HP is probably a requirement for the Western USA density altitude conditions, not an issue in 90% of Europe.

You typically get 900 lbs useful load, 110 knots on 32 litres per hour. Most will today have IFR GPS, DME, NAV/COM/ILS and Mode S. Filled to the tabs this is a reasonably honest two couples or family four seater with three hour range with good reserves.

The 172 also ticks most of these boxes but later models have less useful load, and the Warrior appears to suffer day to day abuse with slightly more aplomb.

Both aircraft (taper wing Warrior or 172) have a statistically meaningful superior safety record.

Oxford (EGTK), United Kingdom

A few random points…

Importing something worth €60k from the USA is not likely to be economical.

Does “light IFR” mean UK-style driving holes in cloud in Class G, or does it mean Eurocontrol IFR i.e. high altitude (typ. FL100+) IFR which is what an IR is normally used for to go places? The former you can do in a C150 with an ILS receiver (probably) and a handheld GPS for actually navigating with. The latter needs a PA28-181 (Archer), not a PA28-161. Obviously this is not clear-cut because e.g. it is possible to fly a Eurocontrol route UK-France at FL070, just about… but much of the year this will just dump you into IMC and icing. A PA28-161 will eventually get to FL110 (I was doing that in Arizona on the FAA IR) but the -181 will do FL140.

As Bosco suggests, almost any normal certified 4-seater will do 4 adults (say 80kg so maybe not “modern size”) and will fly for 3 hrs before the engine stops, leaving a realistic 2hr range (say 200nm).

Setting up the syndicate is going to be the hardest bit, because finding several pilots who have compatible objectives, compatible personalities, compatible depths of pockets for both the initial purchase and subsequent maintenance (scheduled and unscheduled) is hard. Most would-be syndicate members go into it to see what they can get out of it; after all, if they could afford it they would buy a plane outright and have nobody to answer to (one exception being a fresh PPL holder who needs the expertise of others to continue and could not buy his own plane due to a lack of mechanical etc expertise). Consequently the majority of syndicates are not functioning – I think that mirrors normal life too.

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

on the fuel consumpion for your “mission” aircraft dont forget to calc the fuel per distance

250nm trip

aircraft A 45ltr/hr 130kt = 86,5ltr
aircraft B 33ltr/hr 110kt = 75 ltr
aircraft C 38ltr/hr 150kt = 63,3ltr

I think this is much more “real” than per hour unless you are an “hourbuilder”
also this will refelct in costs on mantainance, etc.

I feel if you own your aircraft and look into traveling with it you should look into costs per/mile

off course if you are a club/charter/etc cost per hours are more sensible

fly2000

DR400/180 – one of my favourite aircraft. I would buy one tomorrow.
C172SP – a good workhorse. Holds 4 but can feel a bit claustrophobic in the back on long trips. Ideal for two + dog.
PA28-180 – various versions – ok but a bit underwhelming. In a competition against the 172 I would go for the 172.

There’s not much else out there which wouldn’t embarrass you at maintenance time.

Fly safely
Various UK. Operate throughout Europe and Middle East, United Kingdom

Dave agree on the DR400, brilliant design.

Would love to justify a tourer, but today would rent if I needed four seats airways – probably a PA28R, slab wing.

G-ARAW one of the few 182C with variable incidence trim in Europe, is looking for a new home – a real four place aircraft. As a tourer no reason to run it at 50 litres per hour, 125 knots are possible at 38 litres per hour.

Oxford (EGTK), United Kingdom
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