Several German polities, such as Berlin and Munich, have again stopped giving AstraZeneca to under 60s or under 55s due to more cases of cerebral sinus vein thrombosis (CSVT), the Guardian reports
Graham wrote:
Forgive me if I assumed that was a direct response to me, especially since you cited my use of ‘everybody knows’.
The clue was in my first post on the subject.
I reckon that will have an impact on the extent of vaccine refusal, which is already a huge issue, with 40% reported in France.
Is that really true? Vaccine refusal here is pretty much non existent…just background noise.
That is what I am criticising.
I think we will not know what the % acceptance will be until this is all done and finished.
People have always lied to pollsters, sometimes deliberately to p1ss them off, sometimes because the questions were badly formed, etc. It takes a lot of skill to compose a survey. It also takes intelligence to respond usefully to somebody’s question, never mind a survey.
And with CV19 we have the additional dimension of the massive anti vaxx campaigns on social media, where most people live within a bubble of people with identical views and spend 97.5% of their waking hours virtue signalling to this little group, so can’t be seen to break ranks (but in reality 97.3% of these will still want to fly to Mykonos so they will secretly get vaxxed) 
Well, 97.7% of statistics are made up on the spot
But if any major country really did end up with 40% of people who actually get out and about not getting vaxxed then there will be a big problem because even if they are young and don’t end up in hospital, they will form a pool in which new strains can mutate, and this is precisely what is today’s biggest concern in the UK where vaxxing is running at a nice speed but the lockdown is pretty tight and not ending anytime soon.
The UK is talking about a “top up vaccine” in September which will take care of all known new strains. But the existing vaccines work on all new strains anyway; just not the 100% “serious disease protection” which you get currently.
MedEwok wrote:
Several German polities, such as Berlin and Munich, have again stopped giving AstraZeneca to under 60s or under 55s due to more cases of cerebral sinus vein thrombosis (CSVT),
That is getting serious! According to latest numbers we have 31 cases of SVT after vaccination with AZ. in the last 3 months (with about 20 in the last 4 weeks). Given that we typically see about 50 such cases in Germany per year, that is clearly beyond normal normal statistical variations…
Peter wrote:
and this is precisely what is today’s biggest concern in the UK where vaxxing is running at a nice speed but the lockdown is pretty tight and not ending anytime soon.
They are evidently worried about importing new strains from countries where much more virus is circulating, but it is politically very difficult for the UK to put in really strict measures (hotel quarantine or complete travel bans) for certain European countries, particularly France given how reliant we are road haulage imports and various other sensitivities. Greece and Spain are also politically important for travel to/from the UK.
They have fudged this somewhat by requiring tests if truck drivers are here for more than 48hrs, and in theory they are confined to their cab while in the UK apart from using the lavatory.
Malibuflyer wrote:
That is getting serious! According to latest numbers we have 31 cases of SVT after vaccination with AZ. in the last 3 months (with about 20 in the last 4 weeks). Given that we typically see about 50 such cases in Germany per year, that is clearly beyond normal normal statistical variations…
Indeed. I can’t fathom why we aren’t seeing it though, in a much larger sample.
Graham wrote:
Indeed. I can’t fathom why we aren’t seeing it though, in a much larger sample.
Last week I saw a video from Dr John Campbell where he spoke about the Danish government now recommending vaccinations to be aspirated.
Could it be that there is a difference in how different countries give the vaccine that is resulting in these differences?
I couldn’t figure out from his video if the UK is aspirating or not, but Graham probably knows from his training.
It might explain the differences seen in different countries. Anyone know how the German’s are doing it?
Graham wrote:
I can’t fathom why we aren’t seeing it though, in a much larger sample.
The data is even more strange: According to publicly available information most of the UK cases are male while in Germany it is predominantly an issue for women <60yr.
Graham wrote:
Indeed. I can’t fathom why we aren’t seeing it though, in a much larger sample
A good question. CVST is difficult to diagnose, maybe these few cases got dismissed as strokes in the NHS?
Isn’t there something deeply wrong here. You vaccinate say 1M people, thus prevent say 10k from dying (yes I know it is much less than 1% if you are say 30 but that’s irrelevant) but you then stop the work if you get 10 deaths? That is 3 orders of magnitude below the benefit.
And then there are the non deaths. Many more of those. According to the German doctor quoted here recently, the average hospital stay is 40-60 days. I don’t know the UK figure; probably less than Germany because Germany’s funding system delivers a large quantity of “kit”, but the various UK media coverage of people leaving hospital showed them barely walking at best, and mostly in wheelchairs. If you are flat on your back for that long, you aren’t going to be walking out of there, due to muscle loss and coordination loss. You will be in a wheelchair! That’s if you are say 50-60. If you are older you will probably never walk again. When “old” people break a hip or some such and need surgery, 2wks in bed, they often never walk again because of muscle loss (and they die fairly soon afterwards).
I just don’t get it… The English saying is throwing the baby out with the bathwater.
It looks like a lot of people are looking for a reason to not vaccinate with a particular product, which is nothing to do with the product itself. It’s blindingly obvious actually.
