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Biggest things which stop people giving up flying?

pay the higher fuel and airway fees with the interest the 800.000$ remaining in my bank account generate for me.

Let me check that: interest on bank account for Euros is 0.25% to 1% (direct banks). Inflation is 0.7% in Germany right now, expected to grow, tax on interest is ca. 26%. For 600k€ on the bank, that makes 4500 € a year after tax but before inflation. After inflation that is -1100 €. Not a lot of fuel you can buy for -1100 €!

Let me check that: interest on bank account for Euros is 0.25% to 1%

Maybe you should move to the UK – fixed rates

Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom

First of all I said Euros, different currencies have different interest rates, different countries different inflation rates. The interest on the Zimbabwe Dollar is much higher. Secondly, what’s next said “put the money on the bank”, that is not the same as investing in high yield bonds.

It really is a problem that you can not reliably make money with money anymore. For many years, my savings would give me money to spend every year. Now the return on risk free (that should be “low risk” post financial crisis) is negative. Never been like that since WW II.

Which makes buying a Jetprop more attractive

Nota bene – cash on a bank account isn’t risk free. That’s the biggest lie ever. You have no idea what the bank does with it and it’s 100% at risk if the bank goes t!ts-up.

Let me check that …

Maybe “on my bank account” was a bit simplified. But for 500.000+ Euros you will find a lot of safe investments that yield close to 5 percent of interest, or 3 percent after inflation and taxes. Which leaves you around 20.000 Euros. A C421 needs in the order of 350 Euros for Avgas and Oil per hour plus 100 for Eurocontrol and higher landing fees, subtract the 250 Euros that the Jet Fuel of the Malibu costs per hour and you have an extra cost of 200 Euros per hour (assuming that the maintenance cost for two piston engines is in the order of one turbine). So for 100 hours per year the 421 flies for the price of the Jetprop. With more seats, a lot more comfort (both room and noise) and, most important, two engines.

EDDS - Stuttgart

Nota bene – cash on a bank account isn’t risk free. That’s the biggest lie ever. You have no idea what the bank does with it and it’s 100% at risk if the bank goes t!ts-up.

Germany has an unlimited bank deposit guarantee by the federal government. If you assume the country is solid and remains there, then a cash deposit on a bank can be considered virtually risk free. Of course all nuclear power plants can explode, the Russians can continue their invasion of Europe, etc.

But for 500.000+ Euros you will find a lot of safe investments that yield close to 5 percent of interest, or 3 percent after inflation and taxes.

That used to be true but it no longer is. You simply can’t. For a 5% coupon you have to take a lot of risk today. Irish 10 year bonds yield much less, Spanish bonds less, even Greek bonds yield just around that number right now. And that is ultra high risk. Solid companies pay dividends in the 3% order and that is high risk by definition. Money doesn’t make money anymore unless you’re taking a lot of risk. For fixed interest corporate bonds, you’re in the 1-2% range when the company is considered solid.

Last Edited by achimha at 07 May 09:44

You simply can’t. For a 5% coupon you have to take a lot of risk today.

Do you think? Recently, I bought one from a large traditional German car manufacturer for one year, unfortunately with a much smaller investment sum. If they go bankrupt, then 70 percent of people around me will go as well…

But if you wanted to play it really safe, for 600.000 Euros one could buy a newly built appartment or small house in the Stuttgart area that will fetch close to 1500 Euros of rent a month. Or, in my case, I could simply consume the capital. 600,000 Euros will last me 30 years if I use 20,000 a year for the extra cost of the twin. I’m over 50 already, so probaly won’t be able to spend that money in this life.

EDDS - Stuttgart

Do you think? Recently, I bought one from a large traditional German car manufacturer for one year, unfortunately with a much smaller investment sum. If they go bankrupt, then 70 percent of people around me will go as well…

So we’re talking Daimler AG. A Daimler bond with 5 year duration yields 1.2% before tax right now. That is still a negative return after taxes and inflation. I am talking investing today not enjoying the coupon of an old Daimler bond that you bought years ago before the price of money became negative. I have risk free bank papers at 3.75% that run out next week. They offered me a follow on investment at 0.7%. Great.

But if you wanted to play it really safe, for 600.000 Euros one could buy a newly built appartment or small house in the Stuttgart area that will fetch close to 1500 Euros of rent a month.

That is 3% on the capital before tax and before costs that you cannot charge the tenant for. In reality it is more around 2% and unless you have many millions, you put all your eggs in one basket — a specific apartment. Looks like a crap investment to me, too.

Looks like a crap investment to me, too.

OK, so it looks like it’s going to be Air Berlin – they are offering 6,75 percent right now, and the money stays in aviation Or spread it over a dozen internet start-ups and hope that one of them will be the next Facebook or PayPal…

Last Edited by what_next at 07 May 10:11
EDDS - Stuttgart

In the UK, you have 85k govt-backed investor protection, per institution, so anybody wanting to be ultra careful would spread their 800k ten ways. Easy enough.

But anyway, how would a 421C compare with a Jetprop? The ceiling is similar. The JP goes faster, burns a similar amount of fuel (but the fuel is half the price, once you are outside the UK), pays no IFR charges (another 50 quid an hour or so), but apart from that they must be very comparable in raw mission capability. The 421 can carry far more load. I have flown in both. They are similarly smooth and slick planes.

Edit: just heard from the A&P/IA/EASA66/ATP/CFII who does my TB20 and who worked for years in a CAMO on DA40s and DA42s. He reckons a DA42 is 3x to 4x more expensive to maintain than a TB20, largely due to lots of lifed items. I also recall, from when I used to visit him there, that a lot of odd airframe parts had to be replaced. But then I have to say I have been lucky with my TB20 because it is the later model and because it’s always been well looked after. If you bought a 1984 TB20 which has been neglected you could throw well into 5 figures at it just as a starter…

Last Edited by Peter at 07 May 10:41
Administrator
Shoreham EGKA, United Kingdom
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