garratc wrote:
I guess it´s gonna be a mix between price, condition and fuel burn instead a certain type of aircraft, I like them all
If I may give you an idea to keep you busy:
Look for POH’s for any airplane you think of buying online. You can find them all these days and if not, let me know, chances is I have them in PDF.
Go through the performance section and play with the figures likewise the WnB section. It’s a lot of fun once you get the hang of it and a huge learning experience. And it gives you a much better idea of what you are buying than “pilots reports” in fora. Those however are vital for things like maintenance cost e.t.c. which you can’t find in the POH.
If you really want to go the TB route, I would have a closer look at this 10:
https://www.planecheck.com/?ent=da&id=57267
1993 model, D-reg, recent engine and prop, good interior, decent avionics. All for 79k.
7% EU VAT – how?
Club owned. German rules.
maxbc wrote:
What about the Rallye ? Purchase price seems even lower than TB9/10 and some variants are really capable. From my understanding, you essentially lose some comfort / modern looks. I don’t know if the 4-seater variants are actually able to accomodate 4 people.
greg_mp wrote:
Rally are really uncomfortable. I’m still flying them for mountain stuffs, where they excell, as well as stability, but confort and warm seat are not of its qualities. Ans they are even slower than TB 10 for the same engine.
Full disclosure – I own a Rallye (MS.893E(YOM 1974) in excellent condition). It´s a simple, quirky and special 4 seater airplane. Excellent handling characteristics, fun to fly, fantastic cockpit view with the canopy and it´s a cabriolet. Few, and rather cheap, ADs, and some SBs that are equally cheap. Yes, the air-condition is not good, but you can crank open in flight the canopy 10cm, with no limitations and you get cooled down quick – good fun as well, though somewhat noisy! ;-)
My airframe have the “extended range” fuel tanks with 220L (so, roughly endurance of 5.5-6H to empty) and cruising at 65% power I get an average fuel flow of 36L at a TAS of about 110kts (so yeah slow!).
Empty Weight is 642kgs and MTOW 1050, so with full fuel I can load her up with 253KGs. Take less fuel and you carry more. I don´t think that´s too bad.
I honestly don´t find my aircraft uncomfortable when I fly X-country with my wife and 7 year old when considering the seating arrangements and space, though as mentioned the air-condition, with the canopy, needs to be “dealt” with accordingly. I use Canopy shades for the top. The 180HP+ Rallyes are noisy – so you defo want ANR headsets – that sorts it out.
Now, as it´s been said over and over again in this media, think about your main utilization purpose (80% of the time) first, and secondly the rest. If you´re planning on doing 80% X-country flying with your family – probably the Rallye is not the right airframe.
If you, like me, do 80% fun flying around the neighborhood, and just enjoy throwing the airplane around the skies, and additionally do a couple of long range X-country flights a year (20%), the Rallye could be a great option. Finding one in a good condition it not easy – took me about 2 or so years.
The relatively low investment price is attractive especially considering a first time buyer, since less is lost if you figure out that this is not for you. (Again, it´s only a low investment, if you find one in good condition, otherwise you may need to invest in maintenance before you take your family flying.
I’ve only had a short exposure to a Morane, not sure it was a representative example 
In 2001 a pilot friend and myself, though we were both building our own homebuilt airplanes, went to have a look at one 1962 Morane-Saulnier MS-880B Rallye Club, powered by a mighty O-200-A…
The aircraft had had some hail damage, but was airworthy and advertised for a very low price… so we flew to the place where said airplane was based. I still remember my thoughts looking at it from a distance. Beauty being in the eye of the beholder, and I will only say that we did not find it very attractive…
As we approached the object, the owner appeared, and after a short chat invited us to go and have a flight in it… well, today I’d call that a pretty big vote of confidence, inviting 2 strangers in “go ahead and try out my aircraft” 
So we took off and flew for some 30 minutes before heading back.
The things I remember:
To the OP: as you can see, EuroGA members are very good at giving buying advice. There have been many threads when people were looking to buy some airplane, and always got some founded and expert advice. I’m still impressed by the knowledge base which is available here.
Of course the buying of an aircraft is not only (future) mission dependant, but budget dependant too. Saving on the initial acquisition cost is not always a good idea, as it can quickly bite if having your new toy grounded by recurring maintenance problems…
Good luck in your decision making
Dan wrote:
1962 Morane-Saulnier MS-880B Rallye Club, powered by a mighty O-200-A…The aircraft had had some hail damage
I do think I remember that one. It was in quite good condition as I recall, apart from the (non airworthiness relevant) hail damage.
Dan wrote:
I’d call that a pretty big vote of confidence, inviting 2 strangers in “go ahead and try out my aircraft”
You don’t know for how much it was insured but probably more than the asking price…
We had a big thread here about the Moranes. What people like about them is that they have pretty good STOL characteristics and can get in and out of practically everywhere. If jumping between small airstrips, it can be quite useful. The stronger variants (of up to 235 hp) are amazing load carriers as well while the 100 hp version is probably the most bang for buck you can get out of an O200… after all it has 4 legal seats even though it is WnB limited.
Dan wrote:
In 2001 a pilot friend and myself, though we were both building our own homebuilt airplanes, went to have a look at one 1962 Morane-Saulnier MS-880B Rallye Club, powered by a mighty O-200-A…
Great story, I enjoy that. We have a lot of “fun” memories in aviation that sticks with us.
Dan wrote:
it was very easy to fly
the slats concept was interesting
the performance was miserable
my logbook remark: “What a lemon”
we did not buy it
Dan wrote:
I’ve only had a short exposure to a Morane, not sure it was a representative example
It was probably representative for that particular model you tested (MS 880 100HP). The “shittiest” from a muscle performance point.
Dan wrote:
Of course the buying of an aircraft is not only (future) mission dependant, but budget dependant too. Saving on the initial acquisition cost is not always a good idea, as it can quickly bite if having your new toy grounded by recurring maintenance problems…
I totally agree on this prospect. I think for a first time buyer (such as the OP), you want to go for a solid, good condition airframe, and not go cheap (on the maintenance state of the aircraft). You just want to avoid a bad start into first time ownership (downtime, cost etc.). Now considering the airframe type, as the OP is indicating, it´s relevant to consider airframes (in good condition) of various type to meet the actual, and to some extend, future “needs”. People are very different in their approach to life and investments, but I personally believe more in setting up for immediate success and grow with that, learn from the ownership, and then later on look to advance if needed be. Success is a relative. I would claim that a low cost investment, granted the airframe/asset is in good condition, where you don´t “strain” your finances, is likely to make you feel better about your investment, as opposed to a larger investment that sees you more likely to worry if you made the “right choice”.
Mooney_Driver wrote:
The stronger variants (of up to 235 hp) are amazing load carriers as well while the 100 hp version is probably the most bang for buck you can get out of an O200
I would agree on this as well.
Rally are very good planes but current fleet state is usually in a misérable state. Back seat are usually exposed to airflow through a badly sealed canopy. e.g. 110kn is pretty awesome for a 893, they are not going all that well.
Nevertheless I was close to see this one: https://www.planecheck.com/?ent=da&id=56287
This one is also great but completely overpriced
https://www.planecheck.com/?ent=da&id=55560
It also has a O540 engine.
That one is massively overpriced. One begins to wonder if someone had made a mistake and there is one too many zeros.
